H2O wrote:He questioned the marriage as to its legality of fraternity ties, not about Aisha's age as she was formerly engaged to another man who was an elder.
Bukhari Volumn 007, Book 062, Hadith Number 018.
-----------------------------------------
Narated By 'Ursa : The Prophet asked Abu Bakr for 'Aisha's hand in marriage. Abu Bakr said "But I am your brother." The Prophet said, "You are my brother in Allah's religion and His Book, but she ('Aisha) is lawful for me to marry."
His questioning had nothing to do with Aisha's age. I think you may have gotten this confused.
True, I had assumed it was to do with Muhammad's age. As far as I know Muhammad and Abu Bakr were never "brothers" in a literal sense, so I fail to see how it has anything to do with the legality of fraternity. Maybe you can enlighten me.
H2O wrote:When did the Prophet get marriage to Aisha ? 2 years after the hijrah in 622-623
Aburaees wrote:What here is meant by marriage? Just a Nikkah, or the whole package including consummation?.....
...Yes, she was married at 9 as a marriage isn't complete until it is consummated. She had only been betrothed to him at the age of 6.
Reports say "
Nikah" when she was six 2 years after Hijarah. Engagements ie betrothment take place before Nikah. She was not 6 at this time she was 9-10. You are ignoring the time line which runs inconsistent with the age reports. Some hadeeth report she was betrothed at 6 others say her Nikah was at 6 which is a contraction.
I'm not ignoring the timeline, I'm trying to investigate whether this is purely a semantics issue with one companion using the word Nikkah with a different intention than the other companions.
H2O wrote:Yur understand of Nikah is totally wrong. Once Nikah is performed even if the marriage is not consumated, she and he are legally husband and wife, not a betrothed couple.
Give me some credit! I've actually had my own Nikkah and Walimah. I do see your point though...
Surah Al-Baqarah
[2] There is no blame on you if ye make an offer of betrothal or hold it in your hearts. Allah knows that ye cherish them in your hearts: but do not make a secret contract with them except that you speak to them in terms honourable, nor resolve on the tie of marriage till the term prescribed is fulfilled. And know that Allah knoweth what is in your hearts, and take heed of Him; and know that Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Forbearing.
[236] There is no blame on you if ye divorce women before consummation or the fixation of their dower; but bestow on them (a suitable gift), the wealthy according to his means, and the poor according to his means; a gift of a reasonable amount is due from those who wish to do the right thing.
[237] And if ye divorce them before consummation, but after the fixation of a dower for them, then the half of the dower (is due to them), unless they remit it or (the man's half) is remitted by him in whose hands is the marriage tie; and the remission (of the man's half) is the nearest to righteousness and do not forget liberality between yourselves. For Allah sees well all that ye do.
H2O wrote:You cannot have a divorce unless you are legally married. There is no such thing as devorcing in betrothment. You can only devorce if you are married regardless if cosummation occured or not.
I somewhat agree with you on this, but I would have worded it a little differently. You can only perform
Talaq if you have already performed the
Nikkak. A Talaq
before consummation is different to a Talaq
after consummation due to the different amounts of Mahr remitted to the woman, and her status as either a virgin or otherwise.
A marriage in Islam is like a transaction, you pay the bride-price (Mahr) which secures your right to have intercourse with her. Once you've had intercourse / consummated the marriage / completed the transaction, the full value of the Mahr rightfully belongs to the woman - The Marriage is complete.
I don't have a problem accepting that Aisha was married at 9 years old. My problem is with accepting that there was a 3 year gap from the age of 9 to the time they consummated. There are no Hadiths stating she was 12 at consummation.
There are two ways that the Hadith record permits us to view the situation;
1) They started the marriage process when she was 6 and completed it when she was 9.
Or...
2) They completed the marriage process when she was 9.
Besides, if she had already begun menstruating at the age of 9 (which is definitely possible), it would have been
Islamically lawful for Muhammad to have sex wih her regardless of what the Hadith records say.
I suspect that the whole issue of rejecting the belief that Muhammad had sex with a 9 year old, is just an attempt to appease non-muslims.
There is no historical precedent set by the classical scholars (The Four Sunni Madhabs, and the Main Shia Madhab) in this matter, they were unanimous on the fact that Aisha was 9 when her marriage was consummated.
.