ArchivedThe Latter Rain of the Last Days: Now or Future? :: Re: AineoRe: Aineo
Aineo wrote:The phrase "baptized in the Spirit" is only used twice from Acts through Revelation; in all other references the terms used are "gift(s)" or "filled". Therefore you are totally incorrect in your assumptions of what I believe or teach concerning being "baptized in the Spirit".
Really? Then why are you having so much trouble differentiating between the Baptism of the Spirit (Acts 1:5) and specific manifestations of the Spirit (Acts 2:4, Acts 2:17-18) as different issues?
Aineo wrote:Now common sense tells anyone taking Acts 2 at face value that Peter quoted Joel to explain why the disciples were speaking in tongues. Even Scofield (who is a dispensationalist) sees Joel 2:17-21 being fulfilled in Acts 2. You can verify this by referring to a Scofield Reference Bible. And so does Paul since he quotes from Joel 2:32 in Romans 10:13.
Again, you ignore the fact that Joel 2 speaks about Israel during the Tribulation period, thereby necessitating that Acts 2 only refers to a partial fulfillment of Joel 2:28.
LuckyStrike wrote:LuckyStrike wrote:No, look at the entire chapter of Joel 2.
Verses 1-9 speak of armed forces invading Israel (ref. Zechariah 14:2-5), while verse 10 has signs of the Tribulation occurring in the background (ref. Matthew 24:29). Then verse 11 shows the coming of the Lord taking place (ref. Revelation 19:11-21).
In verses 12 through 17, the Lord calls for Israel's repentance and renewal of heart. Notice that in verse 16, the Lord urges Israel to gather its people together, with the bridegroom and bride leaving their chamber or room. This refers to the end of the Marriage Supper of the Lamb (Revelation 19:6-9), involving Christ and the Church (ref. Ephesians 5:25-33, John 3:29), where Christ and the Church are revealed for the Second Coming (ref. Revelation 19:11-21, Matthew 24:29-31).
After this call, verses 18 through 27 state how the Lord will have pity on Israel (verse 18). He will drive away the Northern Army (ref. Revelation 16:12) (verse 20), repay Israel for the army of locusts that he sent (ref. Revelation 9:1-12) (verse 25), and provide abundance for Israel (verses 19 and 22-23). He ends by promising that Israel will never be shamed again (verses 26-27).
Then, in verses 28 through 32, the Lord promises to pour out his Spirit on Israel (ref. Ezekiel 39:25-29) (verses 28 and 29), while showing signs of the Tribulation (ref. Matthew 24:29, Revelation 6:12) (verses 30 and 31). After this, the Lord promises that everyone who calls upon him will be saved, with salvation coming to the remnant of Israel (ref. Romans 9:27) (verse 32).
Thus, the context of Joel 2 is about Israel going through the Tribulation, not the Church Age.
Now instead of simply declaring that I am wrong, prove that this interpretation of Joel 2 is wrong.
Aineo wrote:It appears that you assume anyone who refuses to accept your theology leans toward the cultish beliefs of the UPC. The fact is the Holy Spirit gives gifts to men as He sees fit, and that includes tongues and prophecy.
No, I asked you two simple questions, which you dodged answering. Here they are again:
LuckyStrike wrote:Let me ask you this: If Acts 2 simply refers to the giving of the Spirit, then should not all people speak in tongues when they are saved? After this, should not all saved people see visions, dreams, and/or prophesy during their lifetime?
Simple "yes" or "no" answers will suffice.
Aineo wrote:1 Corinthians 12:4-11
4 Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5 And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord. 6 And there are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons. 7 But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. 8 For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit; 9 to another faith by the same Spirit, and to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit, 10 and to another the effecting of miracles, and to another prophecy, and to another the distinguishing of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, and to another the interpretation of tongues. 11 But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills. NAS
The only way you can establish your theology is to totally ignore the balance of Scripture:
Ephesians 4:8
8 Therefore it says,
"When He ascended on high,
He led captive a host of captives,
And He gave gifts to men."
NAS
Without appealing to unwarranted assumption, how do you know what "gifts" Ephesians 4:8 is referring to?
There are different "gifts." Salvation is a gift (Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 6:23, etc.), receiving the Spirit is a gift (Acts 1:4-5, Acts 2:37-39, etc.), and abilities given by the Spirit are gifts (Romans 12:5-8, 1 Corinthians 7:7, 1 Corinthians 12, etc.). Thus, when speaking about gifts from God, one must be careful not to equivocate different types.
Aineo wrote:Now you are changing your position. Is Joel 2:28-32 applicable to the tribulation period or is Joel 2:28-32 partially fulfilled in Acts 2 and throughout the church age since the Holy Spirit was given to men and the Holy Spirit distributes gifts as He wills?
No, I have repeatedly asserted that assertion in my previous posts. This is a documented fact that you can observe. Have you been reading my previous posts, or simply skimming them?
| View Parent Message View dfilename Return Home |