Quran and Bible debateJesus never knew of an Allah!Loki wrote:The name Yehovah, pronounced Y'hoVAH in Hebrew, is derived from the verb HYH, meaning "to exist, to be".
The consonant letters of Yahweh or Yehovah are YHWH. The " Y" is a prefix to the consanant leters " HWH" according to the supposed etymology of the word. The consonant letters " HWH" differ from the alleged root " HYH" which is an Aramaic root word whereas " YHWH" is a Hebrew word all together.
Your scholars defined the meaning of a word based on the root of another language. Now according to the Bible, the name YHWH was always known to the patriarches[ reference made below ]. Noah, Enoch, Adam etc did not speak Aramaic or Hebrew.
If this is suppose to be the original name of G-D then it would predate the Hebrew and Aramaic lanuages therefore it cannot have a derividen from such languages.
" YHWH" is a Hebrew word (according to the elite) therefor its Hebrew root should be sought rather than the root of another language. The Hebrew root that coincided with this word is "HWH" which means in Hebrew to ruin, distroy, or cause disaster.
On a linguistical bases it could be understood in relation to the Aramaic root " HYH" but it has no literal etymological relation to it.
Loki wrote:This meaning for His name is first revealed in scripture to Mosheh..... (Moses)
Wrong. I think you need to read your commentaries on Exodus 6:3 that has been grossly mistranslated in which the Hebrew is an interogative question to an affirmative answer that was rendered wrong in English.
The words here rendered, "I was not known unto them," are a mistranslation. The principal Hebrew word in the clause means, "I-made-myself-known."F10 There is also a negative, but it occurs afterward, and the placement of it is optional. Tyndale rendered it thus: "Was I not known unto them?" (Punctuation mine). Remember that punctuation of Biblical texts is purely a human, and therefore, a very fallible thing. We have chosen the Tyndale rendition because it more exactly conforms to the order of the Hebrew words, and if we punctuate it properly, we have this:
"BY MY NAME JEHOVAH WAS I NOT MADE KNOWN UNTO THEM?"
In defense of this punctuation, we may say that it is certainly as "inspired" as that of any of the critics who would like to punctuate it in order to make a contradiction here of other Biblical texts. This exegesis is supported by scholarly opinion of the very highest rank. "The words should be read interrogatively, for the negative particle (not) often has this power in Hebrew."F11 Clark's rendition of the whole sentence is: "And by my name Jehovah was I not also made known unto them?"F12 Regarding the conjunction here (but in the ASV and and in Clark's rendition), it is not in the Hebrew at all either way and is merely supplied by the translator. Robert Jamieson also gave as the preferred rendition here: "By my name Jehovah was I not known to them?"F13 Other discerning scholars of recent times could be cited in this connection, but we have chosen Clark and Jamieson because their works rank as high as any other, have already been received and in use for a century or a century and a half, and are still being printed. We consider their testimony on this point irrefutable. In this connection, it should also be noted that the Cross-Reference Bible of 1910 also gave the proper rendition of the key words here (except for the question mark): "Did I not make myself known?"F14
Therefore, this is our preferred exegesis of the passage, making it a categorical denial and refutation of the critical nonsense that makes this a contradiction of thirty passages in the rest of the Pentateuch. However, even if this obvious meaning of the place is ignored, there are other explanations that will be noted.
http://www.studylight.org/com/bcc/view. ... hapter=006
So if you settle for the custom renderings your going to run into a whole bunch of contradictions.
Loki wrote:Allah has no meaning, it just says "The God" yet the parsis in a same way refer to Ahura Mazda as the God, it's a title....
We are still waiting for Arabic Lexicon references that support this ficticious propaganda. You seem to contradict your self also. You say it has no meaning but still render it "The God" which is a meaning.
Loki wrote:...and neither can the parsis be the same as islam either, since the parsis don't include the people of the book and are the ones who were persecuted by Muhammed. So they weren't practising islam when they prayed to their Allah. Their goes your theory as a proper noun for yahweh.
Well not according to the following source it was used before Muhammad (s.a.w.) by Arabic speaking Jews and Christians as a proper noun:
Allah الله (pronounced: Allaah), is traditionally used by Muslims as the Arabic name of God. The word Allah is not specific to Islam; Arab Christians and Jews, and the Catholic Maltese, also use it to refer to the monotheist deity; for example in Arabic translations of the Bible.
Although the name "Allah" is most commonly associated with Islam, it was also used in pre-Islamic times. It was used by Arab Christians in the pre-Islamic Umm al-Jimal inscription (6th century).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allah
The third is an undated but probably 5th century inscription found in a church at Umm al-Jimal in northern Jordan, a monument to one Ulayh ibn Ubaydah, the secretary of a Roman cohort. This, incidentally, refers to God with the word Allah, showing that Arab Christians' use of the word predates Islam.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pre-Islami ... scriptions
Also the name does not mean "The God" as there is no definite article and there is no contraction nor is it a title.
“Alllaah”
Not a contraction
The English customary spelling “Allah” syllable as “al - lah” in English dictionaries and encyclopedias has often been misrepresented as to its etymology or nature of the word without any Arabic authoritive sources such as Arabic Dictionaries, Lexicons, or Arabic Scholars them selves.
Due to its English customary spelling it is often viewed by western writers that the English transliterated letters “a,l,l,a,h” are a contraction of two Arabic words based on a linguistical prestige (in English not Arabic). Thus being ignorant of the fact, and the language it self, that the second “L” in Arabic script called “laam” is a double consonant letter.
The first two letters “al” is perceived as the definite article (the), and the three following letters “laah” ( sometimes rendered in English as “lah” ) is the contracted Arabic word “ilaah (deity)” where the weak radical “a”, in Arabic called “alif” - pronounced as an “i” in “ilaah”, is dropped for a contraction.
Example
1) al ilah (the deity)
2) al lah
3) al-lah
4) Allah
Based on this western hypothesis, and its manipulative fraudulent philosophy which is misleading, the word is assumed to mean ‘the god’ or ‘the deity’ denoting the supreme deity out of others as the main one. The double consonant “L”(laam) in the original Arabic has been edited in English exegesis of the word as a single consonant giving it a linguistical prestige in English as an “al ilah” contraction. This reason because, the double consonant “L”, which would be properly spelled with three L’s(Alllah) serves no purpose in English as it does in Arabic.
If the customary English spelling of the name it self is transliterated back into Arabic it would spell “ alif, laam, laam, fatah, ha” reading “allah(a)” (Note: This word in Arabic has NO article) which would be a different word in Arabic meaning “Deification” whereas the name in its original Arabic is spelled as “alif, laam, laam, laam, alif maqsoorah, ha’a” reading “alllaah”. On the other hand, a contraction of the words “al-ilah” is not possible in the Arabic language because the grammar behind it does no permit it as will be shown in the reality of the words in their original language which have been manipulated in English.
In The Arabic language when the second radical letter of a word is doubled, by stressing it, it either enhances the word or changes its meaning all together. When the Arabic word “ilaah”(deity) is pronounced as “illaah” by stressing its second radical consonant “L” to double “ll” it changes the meaning from “deity” to “except him” where the “h” consonant is converted into a masculine suffix pronoun.
With the contraction theory of “al ilah” applied in Arabic, rather than in English, the second radical letter “L” in the Arabic word “ilaah” is doubled when the “i”(alif kasrah) is dropped to take the word “al” in order to contract “al” and “lah” in the Arabic language.
EXAMPLE
1) al ilaah
2) al-llaah
3) alllaah
Such an etymological contraction is not possible in the Arabic language in which the word would be meaningless therefore prohibited.
Alllaah
Not A Title
The name however is never used or demonstrated in the Quran or Arabic literature as a title. As an attribute of and reference to Alllah surah(chapter) 114 ayah(verse) 3 in the Quran says: “ilahinnas” ~ God of mankind, which negates the existence of another deity for mankind to be worshiped.
In the Quranic Arabic text the word “ilaah”(deity) does not take a nunnation for an indefinite article to indicate “a deity of mankind”, nor the definite article(the) that would denote Alllaah as being the deity out of other deities.
If the name Alllaah in the Arabic language was understood as “the deity” the attribute “ilahinnas”~ God of mankind would of said “ilahin annas” taking the nunnation(in) to mean “A deity of mankind” or “al ilahinnas” with the definite article(the) to mean “The god of mankind” which would of corroborated with the name Alllah if it was understood or meant “ the deity” or “the god”.
However such a gross statement or its like demonstration is no where to be found in the Quran text or Arabic literature in reference to Alllaah
In support, the renown testimony and article of faith in islam which is repetitively mentioned in the Quran as:
Laa ilaaha illaa alllah
“There is no God except Alllah”
Maa min ilaahin illaa alllah
“there is not a single deity(or other God) except Alllah”
If the name meant “the god” it would not have been used in such a statement, because “laa ilaaha illaa al ilaah ~ there is no God except the god”, and “ maa min ilahin illaa al ilaah ~ there is not a single deity(or God) except the god” is improper Arabic, absurd, and a contradiction to it self, whereas the name Alllaah would not have been possible to be used in such a statement in the Arabic language.
Alllaah
No Definite Article
The name “Alllaah” in the Quranic Arabic text (and Arabic literature) is written in various grammatical forms which has been overlooked much less ignored by critics of the Islamic due to there lack of knowledge of the Arabic language.
These grammatical forms are: “lillaah”, “Alllaahumma”, “yaa Alllaah”, and “aalllaah”, which determine the nature of the word in Arabic.
A noun prefixed with a definite article in Arabic cannot take an additional affix of a “yaa” vocative particle, a “m”(meem) magnifying particle, or a hamza’a interrogative particle, whereas the name Alllaah in many parts the Quran and in Arabic literature is found prefixed with a “yaa” vocative particle ~ “yaa Alllaah”, suffixed with a magnifying particle ~ “Alllaahumma”, and prefixed with an interrogative “hamza” particle ~ “aalllaah”. For example with the prefixed interrogative “hamza” in particle in 10:59 of the Quran
...Qul aalllaahu adhina lakum.
“Say(Muhammad)! Alllaah permitted you ?”
If “al” in the name Alllah was a definite article (the) the prefixing of the “hamza” particle instead of using the interrogative particle “hal” would not be possible or permitted, because the hamza interrogative particle prefixed to the name would have changed “al” to mean, people, folk, or family, as the Arabic word “aal” denotes rather than introducing the name into an interrogative. Thus it would have been meaningless and not used in such grammar.
The preceding ا = a consonant letter called “alif” is the uniform of the word in Arabic which is silent when the name is read suffixly to another word such as: عبدالله = abdu alllaah ~ servant of Alllaah, is read as “Abdullaah”, or the ا = a is absent all together in the possessive form of the word as لله = lillaah where the لِ = li denotes the possessive meaning: to, belonging to, or for, which is not a prefix to the word in Arabic.
In لله = lillaah , the possessive form of the word الله = Alllaah there is no written nor non written assimilated definite article, in which such a clusterized transitional reading of the word would be impossible in the Arabic language if there was a definite article.
The لّه = llaah is the suffix form transition of the word الله = Alllaah by the لِ = li conversion of its first “L” consonant for the possessive, in which a noun with a definite article cannot be suffixed to لِ = li. Only
لِ = li can be prefixed to the article( al = the ) it self which is prefixed to a noun or an adjective word such as : al-quddus ~ The Holy One, with لِ = li prefixed to it as : lil-quddus ~ to the Holy One.
Hence, if “al” in Alllah was a definite article “li” could only be prefixed to it as “li-alllah” not as “lillaah” which would lose the article. The possessive form of the name as “lillaah” confirms that there is no “ilaah ~ deity” word contracted in the name, because the doubling of the second radical “L” consonant, as we said before ,of the contracted word “ilaah” with the dropped “i” for “laah” (as alleged) with the possessive “li” for “li-(i)llaah” would change the meaning of “ilaah ~ deity” to except he or it . Thus is meaningless and would be prohibited in Arabic because it would be absurd and making no sense whereas the possessive form “lillaah” of the name Alllaah would not be possible if such an etymological contraction of “al ilaah” existed.
Even so, an assimilated non written definite article is only possible with “li” when it is prefixed to a noun or adjective word with a “FIRST” radical “L” consonant in this case which is doubled by the prefixing of “li” to assimilate a definite article such as “lateef ~ most gentle” with “li” prefixed to it as “lillateef ~ to the Most Gentle(one)” which is the possessive form of “al-llateef ~ The Most Gentle(one).
To the contrary the un-doubled form of the part “llaah” without “li” is “laah(u)” which means “not him” that is not a noun or adjective but a phrase where as “li” cannot be a prefixed to it wherefore to assimilate a definite article. Therefore, the only possible way the word Alllaah in the Arabic language could take the possessive word “li”, if it had a definite article, or even if it was a contraction of “al ilaah”, would be “li-alllaah”. However ! There is no such thing and is remote there from.
The part “llaah” is only the suffix form transition of the word Alllaah by the “li” conversion of its first “L” consonant to make it a possessive noun. The double “Ls” of “llaah” in the Arabic language are inseparable in which “llaah” is the foundation of the name arabicized as Alllaah that engulfs much linguistical unlimited divine meaning.
These various forms characterize the word of being an ARABICIZED name , whereas with the form " Alllaahumma " being suffixed with the "meem" magnifying particle indicating the vocative and singular royal plural which cannot be used with no other word in the arabic language, clearly tells us that this Name is older than the Arabic language it self being derived from a former and more ancient language which constituted such a grammatical character which does not exist in the Arabic Language as we know it today with any other word.
Another example is how the Name never takes Noonation or Tanween. These are grammatical endings such as "un" "an" "in" which are not used with Arabicized words that are not originally arabic derived.
Such is the folly blunder of the “al ilaah ~ the god” contraction probability of the name Alllaah by western writers who have exploited it as a reality and were morless ignorant of the Arabic language and its nature of grammar to ascribe such a thing but followed their own invented imagination affected by prejudice which was mere and fictitious conjecture.
Also. In Arabic there are many words that begin with “al” such as “alyasa” where “al” is not a definite article. “alyasa” is the arabicized form of the Hebrew name “Elisha”
Lord of the heavens and the earth and what is between them both, so serve Him (alone) and be patient in His worship. Do you know any worthy of His (Alllaah’s) name ? {19:65}
We are still waiting for you (Loki) to reference Arabic lexicons to support the propaganda you decided to blindly accept.
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