ArchivedMinistering to Gays and LesbiansWell Sinomline, you have almost convinced me I need to change my perspective. However, I have a couple of questions. Christ was calling the Jews to “return to God” (repent) since they already had a knowledge of sin. The same is true of Peter’s sermon in Acts 2:38 and 3:19. In Acts 17:30 Paul is recounting to Agrippa the reason why he is being sent to Rome and relates that he was calling the Pharisees to repent (return to or turn back to God). In Acts 26:20 Paul is calling the Greek sophists to repent of their many gods and to turn to the ONE GOD. In Gal.1:6-10 Paul is calling believers to return to the true gospel of Christ. You have referenced what you believe to show that repentance is the first step of salvation, and yet you did not reference the calls to repent in Revelation. To get the full impact and teaching on “repent” we need to look at those also, Rev. 2:5, 16, 21, 22, 3:3,19. In all these Christ is calling the church, the Body of Christ to repent. In all cases except one repent is used to call believers of the law of the gospel to return to God and the truth. Now where does repentance come from? 2 Corinthians 7:9-11 9 I now rejoice, not that you were made sorrowful, but that you were made sorrowful to the point of repentance; for you were made sorrowful according to the will of God, in order that you might not suffer loss in anything through us. 10 For the sorrow that is according to the will of God produces a repentance without regret, leading to salvation; but the sorrow of the world produces death. NAS 2 Timothy 2:24-26 And the Lord's bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged, 25 with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth, 26 and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, having been held captive by him to do his will. NAS Who is Paul addressing in both of these Scriptures; the church, the Body of Christ, not the unsaved pagan world. Can a human being through the exercise of his free will and integrity turn from an immoral activity? Yes. Alcoholics, drug addicts, thieves, etc. who realize the immorality or uselessness of their lifestyles can and do repent of their “sin” and yet do not turn or return to God. I have lived a rather checkered life. I know men and women who have repented of immorality that are not saved. Their decision was based on finances, disgust at what they had been doing, etc. I also know gay men and lesbian women who live sexually pure, celibate lives who find the promiscuity of gay life disgusting. And some of these ceased promiscuous lives without coming to knowledge of sin or of the Lord. How does man become sorrowful according to the will of God, through his own free will, or by the conviction of the Holy Spirit who is the power behind the will of God? Repentance comes from God not the free will of man. Man must exercise his free will to accept the will of God. So what does repentance mean; turn from sin or turn towards God? Is there an order that this process takes? I believe there is and it is found in 1 Thess 5:23-24: 23 Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 24 Faithful is He who calls you, and He also will bring it to pass. NAS It starts with the Holy Spirit convicting us in our God given spirit, moves to our soul (mind, and free will), and becomes obvious with our body (actions). And who calls us and brings it all to pass? GOD! So we are back to: 1 Cor 3:6 6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. KJV Paul sowed the gospel, Apollos did the descipleing, but God brought salvation. With all due respect, I am wondering what kind of a gospel you are advocating because it does not seem to me to be the Biblical one (Matt.3:2; 4:17; Mk.1:15; 6:12; Lk.13:3; 13:5; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 17:30; 26:20?! The Bible clearly teaches that repentance is the first step in the initiation process into the body of Christ (the ekklesia those who are "called out" from the world) and therefore into salvation, for there is no salvation outside of the redeemed community of living Biblical faith (by which I mean inclusive of all true believers throughout human history but not of the institution of either the Roman Catholic Church or any other man-made religious institution) I should therefore be grateful if you would please explain your position? I already have (Matt.7:1-5) You refer to the “ekkliesia those who are “called out” from this world” in other words “sanctified ones”. Sanctification is the sovereign work of God. Christ taught more on “hell” than He did on “love.” And since His ministry was to the Jews who already had the Law, He was calling them back to faith in God to avoid eternal punishment. However, when the gospel was taken to the gentiles, repentance was never mentioned. The Bible clearly teaches that belief through faith is the first step of salvation, not repentance. John 3:16, Acts 16:29-31, Acts 8:37, Acts 15:7, 11, 19:4, Romans 3, etc. You will probably refer to James and what he said about belief and demons, but the demons belief was based in fear, not faith in Christ as their redeemer. So the Bible tells us that the Holy Spirit convicts (a sovereign act of God), man either believes in faith or rejects the truth, and God by grace saves the sinner. The free will of man is sandwiched between 2 sovereign acts of God. God is the initiator and the finisher of our salvation, not man. How are we saved? “We are saved by grace (a gift of God), not works so that no man may boast.” What is grace? Grace is the unearned, unmerited, and unwarranted GIFT of God and to make repentance a prerequisite of salvation is to make grace an earned benefit of mankind’s decisions. A saved life is a changed life, but change happens after salvation as the Holy Spirit calls the “ekklesia” to repentance as a daily part of the Christian’s walk. What is the gospel I teach? The same as Paul – “Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved!” Simonline, you refer to Matthew 7 1-5 to show that you are not judging. However, you are judging in as much as you expect and demand that the gay community live by Biblical morality, a morality they do not believe in or accept. Jerry Falwell, Phelp’s of godhatesfags.com and many in the political religious right are promoting hypocrisy by also demanding that the gay community hold itself to a higher standard than the institutional church holds heterosexuals. Who does God hold accountable? 2 Chron 7:14 14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. KJV Simonline, I did not ask you to comment on the fruit of my ministry, that is between me and God. However, I am the ony one who gave Scott a direct answer to his quesion. All you have done is try to discredit my approach which is both Biblical and works. |
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