Christian/Muslim ThreadsWhy christians reject mohammed as their prophet :: Re: Why christians reject mohammed as their prophetNo their is no prophecy in the bible of any prophet, that indicates a covenant with muhammed. In fact the christians and jews of that time said exactly the same. Alltough their are muslims this day and age who believe the bible does have prophecies about muhammed, but before they get a chance to spout them on this board, i will give them to you rebuted. The prophecies is how God authenticates. He gives prophecy for all major acts he does. He announces them beforehand so that nobody will mistake God's acts for anything else. Jesus' birth as the Messiah was prophesied in Scripture. Mohammed's birth as the so-called Seal of the Prophets was not. Deuteronomy 18:18 "I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and I will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him." their brethren, understood in its proper context of Deuteronomy 18, clearly refers to the brethren of the Levites, that is, other Israelites, not the Ishmaelites. with this argument only, there is no need to refute the rest of the prophecy Who's is the prophecy about then? Well Jesus was a Jew, did miracles as Moses, made a new covenant like Moses, cause before all other prophets only builded further on Moses his Covenant. Jesus was proven to be a prophet (Luke 7:39) and proclaimed himself a prophet (John 4:44). And on top of that Jesus claims to be the prophet Moses foretold (John 5:46). In various places, at various times, various people called Jesus the 'prophet' of Deuteronomy 18:18, yet Jesus never corrected them, rebuked them, or told them otherwise. He always accepted those particular statements. When the Pharisees called him otherwise, He set them straight. Matt. 21:11, John 1:45, 6:14, 7:40, Luke 7:16, 24:19, etc. And after his ascension his disciples confirmed that he was that prophet (Acts 3:22, 7:37) Deuteronomy 33:2 "And he said, The Lord came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them." First of all, the whole argument breaks down when we consider that the One coming in all of these cases is the Lord(see opening phrase of this verse). Muslims would definitely not attribute divinity to Mohammad because doing so would make them guilty of the Islamic sin of shirk, the worst sin according to Islam. Furthermore, Seir and Paran are actually near Egypt in the Sinai peninsula(Genesis 14:6; Numbers 10:12; 12:16-13:3; Deuteronomy 1:1). This eliminates the possibility of Jesus being the one "rising up" from Seir since this is not in Palestine. Furthermore, Paran is, in actuality, hundreds of miles away from Mecca in the northeastern Sinai of southern Palestine A close look at the text also disqualifies on at least two other counts why this prophecy cannot refer to Mohammad. First of all, Mohammad conquered Mecca with 10,000 men, not ten thousandS. At best, Mohammad's regime was only one-half of the necessary number. Furthermore, verse 2 says that the subject "shined forth from Mount Paran," not "shined forth to Mount Paran." Even if Paran is/was Mecca, the verse says that the subject came from there, not went to there as Mohammad and company did. Deuteronomy 34:10-12 "And there arose not a prophet since in Israel like unto Moses..." Concerning not a prophet since IN Israel This prophecy is ripped from its historical setting. What the text indicates is that no prophet like Moses arose in Israel since the time that the verse was written, which was perhaps by Joshua or even Moses himself about 1,400 B.C. John 16:7 "But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you." the Comforter, is clearly identified by the Lord Jesus as the Holy Spirit in John 14:26 John 14:26 "But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you." Again no need to explain the rest of the prophecy with it being baseless. Haggai 2:7-9 "I will shake the nations, and the desired of all nations will come, and I will fill this house with glory,' says the LORD Almighty." Many Muslims claim that Haggai 2:7 is a prophecy about the Prophet Muhammad. They claim that where it says "and the desired of all nations will come" should really read "and the Himada of all nations will come" "ve.hir.ash.ti et-kol-ha.go.yim u.va.u khem.dat kol-ha.go.yim u.mi.le.ti et-ha.ba.yit ha.ze ka.yod a.mar a.do.nai tse.va.ot" -- Haggai 2:7-9 There isn't any Himada in the text, it is a perverted translation of khem.dat wich means desire in hebrew. "the desire of" is not "Himada" in Hebrew but khem.dat. But yes, it does have a individual signifance... but to the Messiah. This verse is very important. It (A) reverses the curse placed on King Jehoiachin in Jeremiah 22:24 (the Messiah's lineage) and (B) God says that the Messiah would come from the lineage of Zerubabbel (the signet ring) (Matthew 1:13). With this context, Muhammad does not fit into the picture. Also, when we read Haggai 2:7, we see that God is speaking of the Temple in Jerusalem. When Muhammad came, was glory brought to the Temple in Jerusalem? No! The Temple in Jerusalem had been destroyed and demolished a few hundred years earlier. Clearly, Muhammad was not "the desired of all nations" to come. Psalm 84:5-6 "Blessed is the man whose strength is in thee; in whose heart are the ways of them. Who passing through the valley of Baca make it a well; the rain also filleth the pools." This psalm is describing the Jerusalem Temple that Solomon built moreso than the Ka'aba in Mecca 1) the tabernacle in Psalm 84 is being described as God's residence within the Jerusalem Temple, the concept of God actually taking residence in the Ka'aba would be foreign to general Islamic theology. 2) In Psalm 84:4 you'll read that people live within this structure. There certainly are not people living in the Ka'aba. However, there were people, particularly caretakers, that lived in the Jerusalem Temple 3) the people are described as going to Zion, which is often used interchangeably with Jerusalem(Isaiah 2:2). More specifically, Mount Zion is one of the hills in which Jerusalem is founded upon. 4) the occupation of doorkeeper does not exist at the Ka'aba whereas it did at the Jerusalem Temple.(II Kings 25:18) Song of Solomon 5:16 "His mouth is most sweet: yea, he is altogether lovely. This is my beloved, and this is my friend, O daughters of Jerusalem." Or how muslims want it to read "His mouth is most sweet: yea, he is Mohammad. This is my beloved, and this is my friend, O daughters of Jerusalem." Muslims assert that since the word for "altogether lovely," machmad, can be translated as "praise" and that Mohammad's name means "praised one" that this is a prophecy of Mohammad. Although the word in this case is used as an adjective, it is claimed that this can be used as a noun. Of course, such an exercise of interpreting an adjective as a noun is unwarranted. Furthermore, if we translate "machmad" as Mohammad in other Biblical verses, we get some interesting passages. 1 Kings 20:6 "Yet I will send my servants to thee tomorrow about this time, and they shall search thy house, and the houses of thy servants; and it shall be, [that] whatever is Muhammad in thy eyes, they shall take [it] in their hand, and carry [it] away." Lamentations 1:11 "All her people sigh, they seek bread; they have given their Muhammad things for food to relieve the soul: see, O LORD, and consider; for I am become vile." Ezekiel 24:21 "Speak to the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will profane my sanctuary, the excellence of your strength, the Muhammad of your eyes, and that which your soul pitieth; and your sons and your daughters whom ye have left shall fall by the sword." In light of the fact that a change in a part of speech(from adjective to noun) is unfounded and that parallel passages show this interpretation to be ludicrous, we can conclude that "altogether lovely" means simply that. Decide for yourself. Habbakuk 3:3 "God came from Teman, and the Holy One from mount Paran. Selah. His glory covered the heavens, and the earth was full of his praise." 1) Teman is 800 kilometers north of Medina. Therefore, there are great geographical anomalies asserted by Muslim apologists in their attempts of fitting Mohammad into this verse 2) We have already seen where Paran is actually nowhere near Mecca. 3) The verse says that "God came from Teman" which is self-explanatory and "and the Holy One from mount Paran." The latter phrase is an example of Hebrew parallelism where our subject, God, is described using a different name than what is used in the first phrase 4) Considering that Muslims would consider it blasphemy(or shirk, as they put it) to associate Mohammad(or anything or anyone else) as God, it is surprising to see this verse ascribed to Mohammad by Muslim apologists. countless of reasons 1. Evidence that he included paganism their are many indications that muhammed included paganism, superstitions and other neighbouring religions in his religion. there's not a muslim on earth that is not gonna say the kaaba and pelgrimage were used in the pagan religion before muhammed arived. In the old pagan religion, they worshipped the stars as God's... and they adored the stones that fell from the sky as gifts from Gods, they kissed and carrried meteorites whenever they went. The Ka'abe worship is of the same principle in wich it's supposed to be one giant meteorite that fell at Adam's feet. The symbol for the ka'aba is a crecent moon, also a old pagan one... Yet the bible tells not to worship the stars. "And beware, lest you lift up your eyes to heaven and see the sun and the moon and the stars, all the host of heaven, and be drawn away and worship them and serve them, those which the Lord your God has allotted to all the peoples under the whole heaven." Deut 4:19 2. Heritage from christian, zoroastrian and jewish sects At the time of Muhammad the New Testament had not yet been translated into Arabic and so he didn't have access to the New Testament manuscripts when recording the Qur'an. However, we know that he was in contact with a number of groups who, although calling themselves Christian, had quite bizarre beliefs. Some people suggest that Muhammad may have been influenced by this and simply incorporated 'heresy' into the text of the Qur'an and there is, in fact, very good support for this view. 3. The Quran is in complete contradiction with the bible alltough it says it confirms the bible "This Quran could not possibly be authored by other than God. It confirms all previous messages, and provides a fully detailed scripture. It is infallible; for it comes from the Lord of the universe." [10] it simply doesn't. the Bible was written long before the Koran, so it is the older standard by which we measure the accuracy of the Koran which arrived over 600 years after the Bible was closed. If you had a copy of Shakespeare which was 100 years old, and you wanted to check it for accuracy, would you go to a bookstore and buy a new copy of Shakespeare? No, you would go to the British Museum and compare your copy to their copy of the original. The bible was being written down as much as 3500 years before Muhammed lived. So, the Bible is the original Word of God, and where the Koran disagrees with the Bible, the Koran falls and is rubbish: "If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder, And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them; Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul." -- Deuteronomy 13:1-3 4. There are no miracles or prophecies in the quran this is against judeo-christian theology wich demands this in order for a prophet to be recognized... allthou they claim the quran is a miracle, and that the moon had splith assunder... neither of them can be seen as truth. A quran is a book like millions of others, and the splitting of the moon was only seen by a few people muhammed coincidently new. Jesus said, "...false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect -- if that were possible. See, I have told you ahead of time" -- Matthew 24:24-25 5. The prophet is rotten Inconsistent, womanizing, hypocritism, theft, deceivery, warlord, pedophile, pirating, superstitious,... you name it. the multitudes who personally knew Muhammad reject him. Did they believe him to be a liar, or a lunatic, or both? Most of the people who had intimate contact with Jesus became His followers. Only a handful of people who had intimate contact with Muhammad accepted him - His clan rejected him almost wholesale "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits... Every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit." Matthew 7:15-17 6. The Quran's history is a fluke - almost no ancient history books left to confirm it's authencity - many indicate plagiarism (over more then 20 stories to say the least are plagiarised from older books) - and recent discoveries of old quran's indicate corruption "The emphasis on the need for copies of the Qur'an to be exact has resulted in the destruction of any copies which differ from the original. Some textual critics argue that this makes an objective and scientific study on the authenticity of Qur'anic codexes virtually impossible, suggesting that this practice simply destroyed variations that had been original to the text." -- Wikipedia, Quran "We did not follow cleverly invented stories when we told you about the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but we were eyewitnesses of his majesty." -- 2 Peter 1:16 "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Me." John 14 that excludes muhammed |
🌈Pride🌈 goeth before Destruction
When 🌈Pride🌈 cometh, then cometh Shame