Most stupid act of Israel

[sardab]

Israel builds an apartheid wall under pretext of security. A wall that draws a fine line between Israelis and Palestines.

Volume 4, Book 52, Number 177:
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."

[Loki]

why do you think they are building that wall?

i don't completly agree with it either since no wall should seperate man, but they were (and maybe still) left with no other choice. I say were because the Arafat era was a terrorist in office who encouraged terrorism for others.

I'd only hope that Abbas will do much much better in perceiving peace, and that will time only tell. Now that the wall is allready set, they might as well leave it their as a precaution.

The rate of terrorist attacks in Israel has drastically lowered since the wall was build, it has saved over hundreds of lifes allready... Now if i were a president and i'd had to choose between a pile of bricks and a thousand of my citizens in the long term, i'd would choose a pile of bricks.

If Palestine ever renounces it's terrorists nature i'd be glad to see the day that the wall would be broken down... i'd be glad if he'd be broken down in Cyprus as well, seems like Israel isn't the only country wich thinks that muslims can be a serious threat to life.

[Kai Hagbard]

sardab wrote:

Israel builds an apartheid wall under pretext of security. A wall that draws a fine line between Israelis and Palestines.

Volume 4, Book 52, Number 177:
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."

Kai responds:

Who was talking about Genocide?

[Aburaees]

[quote="sardab"]

Volume 4, Book 52, Number 177:
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."


quote]


This Hadith contains the very reason why the Jews see it necessary to protect themselves by such methods.

The Muslims look forward to the day when "stones" betray the Jews into the hands of their oppressors.

The Jews have had a hard time from the Muslims ever since Muhammad felt insulted by their rejection.

Look at them, they are very few in number, only 14 million...

and yet 1500 million Muslims still think that the Jews are responsible for all the bad things that happen to Muslims.

.

[sardab]

Hey there. Loki accuses me of hypocrisy because of my message in this thread. Let me show you who is hypocrite.

The reason I opened this thread was the parallelity between Israel's concrete wall and the word "stone" in the hadith. The hadith is a clear warning to this time and thats why I chose the topic name as "most stupid act of Israel.

What happened then? All three messages in response pretended not to see the point. Well if you are not mentally retarded then you are all hypocrites.

Stop mumbo jumbo and get a real life.

[newseed]

Hey there. Loki accuses me of hypocrisy because of my message in this thread. Let me show you who is hypocrite.

The reason I opened this thread was the parallelity between Israel's concrete wall and the word "stone" in the hadith. The hadith is a clear warning to this time and thats why I chose the topic name as "most stupid act of Israel.

What happened then? All three messages in response pretended not to see the point. Well if you are not mentally retarded then you are all hypocrites.

Stop mumbo jumbo and get a real life.

Hurling insults breaks forum rule #4

No slandering other posters or dealing in personalities. Some posters hold strong opinions about topics under discussion however, resorting to name calling or derogatory remarks aimed on any poster will not be tolerated. Take you personal differences to emails or private messages. Posting private communications or alluding to such communications on any public forum will be grounds for deactivation of your account and the deletion of your post.

If you continue, you account will be suspended.

This IS your only WARNING!

[sardab]

whatever...

[Loki]

"most stupid act of Israel"
in what regard?
that all jews shall be killed now by muslims, for putting up a safety wall?

is that your compassion you mean?
"there's all gonna die! most stupid act by the jews!!"
that's like the grinn of a chess player before he sets his opponent check mate

again putting such verses in such context provoce hatred instead of peace. Indoctrinate such verses to young palestine muslim kids or fundemental muslims and they'll make up a death squadron with a hundreds of dead innocent people as a result. Even secular muslims could get more determint in everyday hating of jews by such verses... overall such will arise more hatrend then love and no progress for peace whatsoever.

When i adressed you as being a hypocrit, it was because you came of as being all peacefull... and then i gave a reference to this forum, that you speak with a double tongue that's all... you must not take this so personally, i have much respect for any muslim who commes in here debating, for it must be very hard for them to debate an army of christian apologetics... in a same way that i respect the lone christian apologetic on muslim boards. But that doesn't mean i have to agree with everything you say or look the other way when i see you trippin' on your own words.

[Truth Seeker-Joshua]

What happened then? All three messages in response pretended not to see the point. Well if you are not mentally retarded then you are all hypocrites.

Thats because your point is ignorant. Someone using more than half their brains wouldn't respond to something so lacking in truth.

The problem is, the so-called "palestinians" would have never been there if egypt and jordan didnt leave them for dead.
Rather than trying to talk in negotiations after 1967, to bring their countrymen home, they left them their and used it as an excuse to demonize Israel for so-called oppression.

The Jews, with their own history of being shipped of from other countries, refused to put another race on a train and ship them off, when they had no country to call home.

And dont even start the original inhabitants of the land issue. Roman and Ottoman maps show that the original territory of palestine sits in the southern area of jordan. The jordan government could have easily accomidated these displaced arabs, but refused.

You posts and support for palestinians have nothing to do with them, or the truth. It has to do with your hatred of the Jews and Christians.

Peace and Godspeed
Pray for Israel

[Truth Seeker-Joshua]

Oh BTW sardab,
Whats your opinion on this...
I notice no muslims had the courage to comment on it. They just ignore it until it slowly sinks to the bottom of the topic page.

http://www.jesus-christ-forums.com/home/viewtopic.php?t=6257&highlight=

[Joseph]

The problem is, the so-called "palestinians" would have never been there if egypt and jordan didnt leave them for dead. Rather than trying to talk in negotiations after 1967, to bring their countrymen home, they left them their and used it as an excuse to demonize Israel for so-called oppression.

Joshua, the "so-called palestinians" comment is superfluous if not embittering. Although you are correct Palestinians were/still being used as pawns by their leaders and Arab states, very little else is simple as you have stated. Discussing any ME problem then saying the solution can be easily accommodated is non sequitur. There are no angels in Israeli/Arab 100 year conflict and its complexities frustrate ME experts let alone a layperson, such as myself. I do not wish to go further on this except to conclude with personal statement on Israeli/Palestinian conflict.

Above all I serve the Lord Jesus and pray He makes me an instrument of peace. I pray peace for the Israelis, Palestinians and Arabs

Peace and Godspeed

Amen

joseph

[H2O]

Oh BTW sardab,
Whats your opinion on this...
I notice no muslims had the courage to comment on it. They just ignore it until it slowly sinks to the bottom of the topic page.

I went back and looked at that link. WHy should we when the source you quoted whom were muslims whom discovered it condemned it. I know what you are talking about.

[Loki]

Oh BTW sardab,
Whats your opinion on this...
I notice no muslims had the courage to comment on it. They just ignore it until it slowly sinks to the bottom of the topic page.

I went back and looked at that link. WHy should we when the source you quoted whom were muslims whom discovered it condemned it. I know what you are talking about.

and who are the real muslims? those that send out hatred,
or those that condemn it?

and by whose opinion/authority?

[H2O]

and who are the real muslims? those that send out hatred,
or those that condemn it?

and by whose opinion?

Well Loki, those who tought such a thing will be punished unless they repented and change what is in their hearts.

They all are muslims, but their prejudice act is kufr ie disbelief. What will make them not muslim is if they didnt all together adhere to the fundamentals of islam or if they renounced islam.

[Truth Seeker-Joshua]

I kinda notice that H2o didn't really come out and comdemn it himself.
(Probally because he really agrees with it.)

[Loki]

Well Loki, those who tought such a thing will be punished unless they repented and change what is in their hearts.

They all are muslims, but their prejudice act is kufr ie disbelief. What will make them not muslim is if they didnt all together adhere to the fundamentals of islam or if they renounced islam.

Qur’an 2:64 “But you [Jews] went back on your word and were lost losers. So become apes, despised and hated. We made an example out of you.”

Qur'an 59:14 “The Jews are devoid of sense. There is a grievous punishment awaiting them. Satan tells them not to believe so they will end up in Hell.”

Qur’an 4:55 “Sufficient for the Jew is the Flaming Fire!”

Is Muhammed also a kufr? did he also need to repent and change his ways?

Or is Muhammed the major fundemental of Islam, and those Saudi's that quoted muhammed's opinion in their own words not just merely being a muslim like muhammed was one?

Do you condemn muhammed too?

[Liberate]

and who are the real muslims? those that send out hatred,
or those that condemn it?

and by whose opinion?

Well Loki, those who tought such a thing will be punished unless they repented and change what is in their hearts.

They all are muslims, but their prejudice act is kufr ie disbelief. What will make them not muslim is if they didnt all together adhere to the fundamentals of islam or if they renounced islam.

It is ironic H2O speaks about muslims are not muslims if they reject the fundamentals of islam when he himself does not believe in the fundamentals of islam, he rejects hadiths at whim claiming that they contradict the koran when in fact they do no such thing only exposing the stupidity of the religion in the light of an enlightened age such as believing a stone runs away with Moses clothes which is the basis for sura 33:69, he believes that Jesus is dead somewhere and the hadiths that claim Jesus is coming back are merely figurative, he also claims the hadiths over the dajjal are figurative, and the hadiths relating to the mahdi are also figurative, I am still wondering how he interprets the hadith that Jesus lives for another 30 years and gets married, we still do not know which islamic school of thought he represents, he contradicts the teachings of the sunni which represent 90% if islam who accept Bukhari and Muslim ahadith, as well as the Shais who represent 5% of islam, the other remaining include the fringe groups regarded as apostates by the fundamentalists such as the ah madiyya movement and the Nation of islam, H2O indirectly claims Bukhari Muslim, and Ibn Kathir are idiots who do not understand what is meant in the koran, H2O has been confronted by fellow muslims over his ridiculous stance without a qualification to make a word he says worth the internet font it is written in. H2O will tell you islam is peace while at the same time openly applauding the murder of Theo Van Gogh in this forum, apparently in the news recently the koran has been splattered with urine, you will notice just how peaceful this religion of peace really is when it's adherents start demanding apologies for the koran being splattered with urine and killing kaffirs because of this, contemplate if it had been the other way round, that the bible had been splattered in urine, would christians be demanding apologies? would christians be suicide bombing non christians because of this? would they go on the rampage killing non christians because they desecrated the bible? The entire religion from the onset is not peace it is a tyrannical fascist dogma based on racism created by either a demented individual or spiritually deceived or both, aimed to overide your free thought and replace it with a pack mentality based on bravado regardless of how idiotic that bravado is, hence God only tolerates arabic and you must only pray to Him in arabic, and women must be covered from head to toe in a face blanket, hence you will hear muslims scream "God is great" as they rape, kill and desecrate the lives of kaffirs,

[H2O]

Qur’an 2:64 “But you [Jews] went back on your word and were lost losers. So become apes, despised and hated. We made an example out of you.”

Qur'an 59:14 “The Jews are devoid of sense. There is a grievous punishment awaiting them. Satan tells them not to believe so they will end up in Hell.”

Qur’an 4:55 “Sufficient for the Jew is the Flaming Fire!”

Loki, I dare you to post up these verses in their context, and quote whom the translator is that your getting this from.

2:64 is speaking about a group of Jews that violated the sabath diliberately and they were cursed for their disobedience.

59:14 is not speaking about Jews in general but a part of Jews that assisted the Makkan pagan against the muslims

4:55 is not even speaking about Jews at all it is speaking about Abraham's people whom learnt sorcery, that is whom it is speaking about.

[Loki]

i have more quotes where that came from
in other sources the similar hatred for jews is repetitious as well

Quran:

Qur’an 33:26 “Allah made the Jews leave their homes by terrorizing them so that you killed some and made many captive. And He made you inherit their lands, their homes, and their wealth. He gave you a country you had not traversed before.”

Qur’an 59:14 “They [Jews] will not fight against you save in fortified townships. Their hostility and hatred amongst themselves is strong: you would think they were united, but their hearts they are divided. That is because these [Jews] are a people devoid of sense.”

Qur’an 2:59 “We sent a plague upon the Jews from heaven, for their evil-doing.”

Qur’an 59:17 “Both [Jews and Satan] will go into the Fire of Hell, dwelling therein forever. Such is the reward of the Zalimun (disbelievers and polytheists).”

Qur’an 3:85 “If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (Surrender), never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter He will be in the ranks of those who are losers.”

Qur’an 33:26 “Allah took down the People of the Scripture Book. He cast terror into their hearts. Some you slew, and some you made prisoners. And He made you heirs of their lands, their houses, and their goods, giving you a land which you had not traversed before.”

Hadiths:

Bukhari:V4B56N679 “Allah’s Apostle said, ‘Plague is a means of torture sent on the Israelis.’”

Bukhari:V2B23N457 “The Prophet went out after sunset and heard a dreadful voice. He said, ‘The Jews are being punished in their graves.’”

Bukhari:V5B59N362 “He exiled all the Qaynuqa Jews from Medina.”

Bukhari:V4B52N270 “The Prophet said, ‘Who is ready to kill Ka’b bin Ashraf who has really hurt Allah and His Apostle?’ Muhammad bin Maslama said, ‘O Allah’s Apostle! Do you want me to kill him?’ He replied in the affirmative.”

Bukhari:V1B1N6 “Just issue orders to kill every Jew in the country.”

Bukhari:V4B52N176 “Allah’s Apostle said, ‘You Muslims will fight the Jews till some of them hide behind stones. The stones will betray them saying, “O Abdullah (slave of Allah)! There is a Jew hiding behind me; so kill him.”’”

Bukhari:V5B59N362 “So the Prophet killed the Qurayza men. He distributed their women, children and property among the Muslims.”

Ibn Ishaq's Biography of Muhammed:

Ishaq:240 “The Jews are a nation of liars.... The Jews are a treacherous, lying, and evil people.”

Ishaq:250 “The bestial transformation occurred when Allah turned Jews into apes, despised.”

Ishaq:254/Qur’an 2:96 “We will not remove a Jew from the punishment. They know the shameful thing that awaits them.”

Ishaq:524 “We cannot accept the oaths of Jews. Their infidelity is so great they swear falsely.”

Ishaq:245 “Do you love Jews and their religion, you liver-hearted ass, and not Muhammad? Their religion will never march with ours…. Jews make false professions about Islam. So Allah sent down: ‘Satan wishes to lead them astray.”

Ishaq:248 “Allah increases their sickness. A tormented doom awaits the Jews. Allah said, ‘They are mischief makers. They are fools. The Jews deny the truth and contradict what the Apostle has brought. I will mock them and let them continue to wander blindly.’”

Ishaq:262 “Some Muslims remained friends with the Jews, so Allah sent down a Qur’an forbidding them to take Jews as friends. From their mouths hatred has already shown itself and what they conceal is worse.”

Ishaq:254 “Long for death [Jews], if you are truthful. Pray that God will kill whichever one of us is the most false. The Jews refused the Prophet’s dare.” “Allah said to His Prophet, ‘They will never accept your dare because of their past deeds. But they recognize you from the knowledge they have. Yet they deny. Had they accepted your dare, not a single Jew would have remained alive on the earth.”

(i like this one)
Ishaq:256 “The Jews used to ask Muhammad questions which annoyed and confused him.” Ishaq:257 “Your situation seems obscure to us, Muhammad.”

Ishaq:363 “The Jews of the Qaynuqa replied, ‘Muhammad, do you think that we are like your people? Do not be deluded by the fact that you met a people with no knowledge and you made good use of your opportunity.’”

Ishaq:364 “Muslims, take not Jews and Christians as friends. Whoever protects them becomes one of them, they become diseased, and will earn a similar fate.”

(i like this one too)
Ishaq:365 “Ka’b bin Ashraf was from the Jewish clan of Nadir. When he heard the news, he said, ‘Can this be true? Did Muhammad actually kill these people? These were fine men. If Muhammad has slain them, then the belly of the earth is a better place for us than its surface!’” Ishaq:365 “When the enemy of Allah became convinced the report was true, he set out for Mecca. He began to arouse people against Muhammad [i.e., he exposed him]. He recited verses in sympathy for the Quraysh men Muhammad had cast into the pit. Ka’b Ashraf composed the following poetic lines: ‘The blood spilled at Badr calls to its people. They cry and weep. The best men were slain and thrown into a pit.’” Ishaq:365 “Drive off that fool of yours so that you might be safe from talk that makes no sense. Why do you taunt those who mourn over their dead? They lived good lives, and as such we must remember them. But now you have become like jackals.”

Ishaq:368 “Ka’b’s body was left prostrate. After his fall, all the Nadir Jews were brought low. Sword in hand we cut him down. By Muhammad’s order we were sent secretly by night. Brother killing brother. We lured him to his death with guile [cunning or deviousness]. Traveling by night, bold as lions, we went into his home. We made him taste death with our deadly swords. We sought victory for the religion of the Prophet.”


anything that agrees with the quran,
you can't throw it away? not?

[john doe]

I find it staggering how Islam still tries to label itself as piece dwelling; I’m just thinking about the roots and fruits notion. I suppose Muslims would say that I’m reading them all out of context, because they cannot justify them…ethically.

I guess Jacques Derrida’s “Deconstruction Theory” is no nonsense……the reader rather than the author is central in determining meaning.

[H2O]

Perhaps you are. Maybe we should start judging christianity based on what its adheres do and have done.

the problem with most of your your too busy feeding off of negativity from your own pears. When since do you go to a Sailor to know how to fly a Plane ?

[john doe]

Perhaps you are. Maybe we should start judging christianity based on what its adheres do and have done.

the problem with most of your your too busy feeding off of negativity from your own pears. When since do you go to a Sailor to know how to fly a Plane ?

I don’t judge Christianity by what some have done; I judge it by what it is.

Love your enemy as yourself, that’s Christianity for me in a nutshell.


Islam preaches hate, death and destruction; I’m not talking about Muslims, I’m talking about your Creed....Creed you are just the victim of that creed.

[H2O]

Islam preaches hate, death and destruction; I’m not talking about Muslims, I’m talking about your Creed....Creed you are just the victim of that creed.

This is exactly my point, its your misled understanding of our creed, period.

[john doe]

Islam preaches hate, death and destruction; I’m not talking about Muslims, I’m talking about your Creed....Creed you are just the victim of that creed.

This is exactly my point, its your misled understanding of our creed, period.

I don’t think so, it’s written all there and you don’t need a genius to interpret it.


Think about it, the history of your religion was forged with war, that’s the essence of it, that’s the nature of it, no matter how much you try and rectify it.

It doesn’t really matter because you will never admit the fact that your creed is wicked even if you thought it was, perhaps you see that wickedness as a virtue.

Bottom line: your creed is vile, that’s what I’ve read and that’s what I got. Period.

[Loki]

Islam preaches hate, death and destruction; I’m not talking about Muslims, I’m talking about your Creed....Creed you are just the victim of that creed.

This is exactly my point, its your misled understanding of our creed, period.

tell that to the raped females, the persecuted christians, jews, 'fire worshippers' and pagans under muhammed's rule...

try and explain them how great Islam really is, and that they missunderstood the sword that was slitting their throat... tell them that muhammed really ment peace and tolerance with that...