Does witchcraft mean pharmakeia?

[webmaster]

what is witchcraft? that which we call something unfamiliar and what looks like witchery.

in the ancient days, modern day pharmacy would have been considered witchcraft.

harry potter is not witchcraft. compared to what i have read about witchcraft, harry potter is nothing. it teaches nothing satanic. sigh. children today are innocent and pure, they see friendship, love, trust, and most of all good conquers evil, a common story theme.

[webmaster]

In 1976, doctors in Los Angeles went on strike because of the rising cost of malpractice insurance. All elective and non-emergency surgery and medical attention were canceled. During that time, 18 percent fewer people died than usual.

From all our exposure to unnecessary penicillin through medication as well as through treatment of cattle and pork, life-threatening bacteria have grown resistant to our number-one line of defense. In 1960, 13 percent of staphylococci infections were resistant to penicillin. Now, 91 percent are resistant to penicillin.

There is a phenomenon called noscomial disease. It means coming to a hospital for some reason, and catching another disease while in the hospital. Hospitals are not healthy places. One out of every 21 Americans admitted will catch something else merely from being in the hospital. Every year, 15,000 Americans die of something other than what they were admitted for.


http://members.aol.com/oddwonder/medicine.htm

[webmaster]

The disaster was the "Elixir of Sulfanilimide" tragedy of 1937 in which 107 people were killed as the result of the use of a solvent, diethylene glycol, in a product. Since the law did not require prior testing of drugs for safety, there was no way to anticipate, or prevent, the marketing of this lethal mixture.

Then we come to one of the most abused pharmaceutical drug on the market today with terrible side effects. It’s a relatively new pain medicine called OxyContin. This drug contains a powerful alkaloid derived from opium. It has replaced cocaine, heroin and ecstasy as the number one killer in the State of Florida. People suffering from tremendous pain have become junkies on this drug. OxyContin sales in the year 2000 alone were over a billion dollars. OxyContin is fast becoming the new drug of choice in America. The tablets are manufactured in a time-released delivery system so the mind-altering effects of the opium alkaloid are not experienced by the users. They are designed to deliver painkilling effectiveness for between a 12 and 24 hour period. On the street users either chew the tablets, crush them and snort the powder, or boil down the tablets and inject it intravenously because it bypasses the time-released system and delivers a powerful euphoric, heroin-like punch. Entire towns and neighborhoods are dealing with problems associated with OxyContin. The Roanoke Times ran a story on August 16, 2000 that reported OxyContin to be the worst problem seen in the community. “Tazewell County’s prosecutor has charged more than 150 people in the last year with felonies associated with the addictive painkiller… Tazewell County Commonwealth’s Attorney Dennis Lee called abuse of OxyContin an epidemic… Andy Anderson, a narcotics detective with the Pulaski Police Department, estimated that 90 percent of the people in Pulaski who admit to such crimes as breaking and entering, shoplifting, forgery or stealing checks said they committed the crimes to get money to finance their OxyContin addiction.”

http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/2000/200_miles.html
http://www.quackwatch.org/13Hx/MM/08.html

Strong's Number: 5332
Transliterated: pharmakeus
Phonetic: far-mak-yoos'
Text: from pharmakon (a drug, i.e. spell-giving potion); a druggist ("pharmacist") or poisoner, i.e. (by extension) a magician: --sorcerer.

Strong's Number: 5331
Transliterated: pharmakeia
Phonetic: far-mak-i'-ah
Text: from 5332; medication ("pharmacy"), i.e. (by extension) magic (literally or figuratively): --sorcery, witchcraft.

[wigginsmum]

??? Is this thread about witchcraft or something else?

Jules

[webmaster]

It's about the other side of it.

[wigginsmum]

Can you expand on it as I'm not sure what you're getting at? Are you saying that the medical profession is guilty of witchcraft because of the chemicals in the medicine they prescribe? Medical science has nothing to do with witchcraft, and I don't know any witches who are poisoners. Witchcraft is idolatry and the use of magic.

Jules

[webmaster]

There are 2 sides to this issue, the spirit side and the secular side.
I fully believe that God covers both aspects in the Old and New Testaments.
Like with the dietary laws. I fully believe they have a spiritual side and a secular side. http://www.jesus-christ-forums.com/home/viewtopic.php?t=4485

By secular I mean something to benefict us normal humans.

Medical Science today is good, a LOT better then it use to be. To fully understand the past history and fully explain it will take some research.

[webmaster]

Word study

A study of the Greek words pharmakeia (Strong's 5331) and pharmakeus (Strong's 5332).

Strong's Exhaustive Concordance:
"5331. pharmakeia ... from 5332; medication ('pharmacy'), i.e. (by extension) magic (literal or figurative)."
"5332. pharmakeus ... from pharmakon, (a drug, i.e. spell-giving potion); a druggist ('pharmacist') or poisoner, i.e. (by extension) a magician."


Webster's New Collegiate Dictionary:
"pharmaceutical ... from Greek pharmakeutikos ... a medicinal drug."
"pharmaco- ... Greek pharmako-, from pharmakon ... medicine : drug."
"pharmacology ... the science of drugs."
"pharmacy ... from Greek pharmakeia ... the art or practice of preparing, preserving, compounding, and dispensing drugs ... a place where medicines are compounded or dispensed ... DRUGSTORE."

http://www.topical-bible-studies.org/13-0018.htm

pharmacy - c.1386, "a medicine," from O.Fr. farmacie, from M.L. pharmacia, from Gk. pharmakeia "use of drugs or medicines," from pharmakeus "preparer of drugs," from pharmakon "drug, poison, philter, charm, spell, enchantment." Meaning "use or administration of drugs" is attested from c.1400; that of "place where drugs are prepared and dispensed" is first recorded 1833. Pharmacist coined in Eng. 1834.

pharmaceutical - 1648 (pharmaceutic in the same sense is from 1541), from L. pharmaceuticus "of drugs," from Gk. pharmakeutikos, from pharmakeus "preparer of drugs, poisoner," from pharmakon "medicine, poison." Pharmacology is attested from 1721, formed in Mod.L. (1683) with Gk. -logia "dealing with the topic of."

http://www.etymonline.com/p5etym.htm

· The Greek word pharmakeus is a "druggist or poisoner". This Greek word translates as sorceries in Revelation 9:21, and sorcerers in Revelation 21:8 &22:15. (9:21) "Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts. (21:8) " But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. (22:15) "For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie." This Greek word (pharmakeus) has a root (pharmakon) meaning "a drug, i.e. spell-giving potion"

http://www.holybiblesays.org/articles/drugs.htm


My wife's mother has been addicted to pain pills and Valiums for the past 20 years. The doctors just keep on giving them to her. This is the secular side.

This is the non-secular side
http://www.jesus-christ-forums.com/home/viewtopic.php?t=2238

Back to the secular side
If we go back in time 2500 years ago we had the local aka doctor mixing who knows what together killing most of his patients. Herb medicine is good and there is nothing wrong with it to a point but the majority of it is basically just voodoo science like when they use to bleed people when they was sick. There was also the cupping side http://www.web-ministry.com/linear.php?postID=9593


Now there is the propaganda side. This is not what God meant.
But people take this concept and twist it into Garbage.

So in Galations 5:20, Paul is telling us that those who use chemical potions (such as aspirin or Tylenol) to cure diseases or disease symptoms are accursed of God.

http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/wicca1132/ ... ition.html


Does all of this better explain it?

[webmaster]

Here is some more info on Herbal medicines.

Liver Injury in 12 Patients Taking the Herbal Weight Loss Aids Chaso or Onshido
http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/139/6/I-47

FDA Expands Warning About "Green Hornet" to Include All Other Products by Cytotec Solutions, Inc
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/cgi/medlineplus/ ... 049%2Ehtml

Yet More Evidence Echinacea Does Not Fight Colds
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/news ... 18363.html

Herbal Medicine (National Toxicology Program)
http://ntp-server.niehs.nih.gov/htdocs/ ... dFacts.pdf

The FDA now plans to assault herbal medicines
http://www.newstarget.com/7000808.shtml

Herbal Abortions
http://www.w-cpc.org/abortion/herbal.html

Now there are the good side of Herbal Medicine. I am not attacking the entire concept of it. But with the craze nowdays of putting every plant/root/seed without being fully tested on the market, making claims as bad as the "snake oil" days of what it can do we are being stupid.

Some of these Herbal and Drug Companies are basically practicing Witchcraft.

Doctors who prescribe pain pills to the same person for years are basically practicing Witchcraft.

Drug Dealers are basically practicing Witchcraft.

God warned us about these things because until recently we wasn't capable of understand the facts concerning them.

[wigginsmum]

"Doctors who prescribe pain pills to the same person for years are basically practicing Witchcraft. "

Really? I'd disagree. I slipped a disk in my back in 1989. Since then I have been in moderate to severe pain most of the time. I take two types of painkillers most days just so I can get out of bed and keep working to pay my mortgage. I had an epidural injection last year in my spine because the other option was risky back surgery. So to be told that I, a former witch, am partaking in witchcraft by taking medicine for a medical condition is frankly outrageous lunacy. I normally appreciate your occult investigations but this one is way off the wall and very wrong.

I wish I didn't have to take tablets but God hasn't seen fit to heal me yet, and condemnation from a fellow believer doesn't help, does it? I really hope you wouldn't judge a cancer patient for having chemotherapy.

Jules

[mark]

Buenos Noches Webmaster,

I must say that you are not correct in your current line of investigation...
here is something I put together elsewhere that might help you.

Other places the word Kashaph is used in the Bible.

De 18:10 There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,

so.... does poisoner really fit there? hmmm


Ex 7:11 Then Pharaoh also called the wise men and the sorcerers: now the magicians of Egypt, they also did in like manner with their enchantments.

Do poisoners use enchantments????

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ex 22:18 Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.

The infamous verse that always seems to kick off this argument.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------


2Ch 33:6 And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom: also he observed times, and used enchantments, and used witch craft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards: he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger.


Again with the enchantments and such....

=======================
Da 2:2 Then the king commanded to call the magicians, and the astrologers, and the sorcerers, and the Chaldeans, for to shew the king his dreams. So they came and stood before the king.

Here's a question for you.... why would the King... call poisoners to shew
him his dreams???


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

And kasheph....

Mic 5:12 And I will cut off witchcraft s out of thine hand; and thou shalt have no more soothsayers:


poisoners on a par with soothsayers? probably not.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

And Kashshaph.........


Jer 27:9 Therefore hearken not ye to your prophets, nor to your diviners, nor to your dreamers, nor to your enchanters, nor to your sorcerer's, which speak unto you, saying, Ye shall not serve the king of Babylon:


and again.. you see... 'poisoners' really doesn't fit here either...

there are a few more verses.. but those are the various iterations of the
Hebrew word Kashaph....

I put this together for the benifit of those using the 'pharmakeia'
line of argument to say that God wasnt really talking about witchcraft..
just poisoners...
*shrugs*
it doesn't wash.
Doctors and pharmacists, while some of them are incompetant...,
are not practicing witchcraft by plying their trade.

And yes, I speak as one who is very familiar with what witchcraft actually is.

His servant,
Mark

[webmaster]

If you wish to discuss the HEBREW word Kashaph used in the OT then here is the place.
http://www.jesus-christ-forums.com/home/viewtopic.php?t=2238

We are speaking about the NT Greek Word pharmakeus and pharmakeia.

You should also re-read this entire thread and listen to what was said.

[webmaster]

"Doctors who prescribe pain pills to the same person for years are basically practicing Witchcraft. "

Really? I'd disagree. I slipped a disk in my back in 1989. Since then I have been in moderate to severe pain most of the time. I take two types of painkillers most days just so I can get out of bed and keep working to pay my mortgage. I had an epidural injection last year in my spine because the other option was risky back surgery. So to be told that I, a former witch, am partaking in witchcraft by taking medicine for a medical condition is frankly outrageous lunacy. I normally appreciate your occult investigations but this one is way off the wall and very wrong.

I wish I didn't have to take tablets but God hasn't seen fit to heal me yet, and condemnation from a fellow believer doesn't help, does it? I really hope you wouldn't judge a cancer patient for having chemotherapy.

Jules

You are combining the 2 concepts and adding words I never said. You need to re-read what I wrote instead of glancing thru it just to disagree.


"Doctors who prescribe pain pills to the same person for years are basically practicing Witchcraft. "
If the doctor prescribes a pain killer for years and the pain killer is addictable then yes the Doctor is practicing Witchcraft. He is hurting the person more then he is helping the person. The doctor has become a poisoner! Do some research on the Elixir of Sulfanilimide. Rather created in a lab or cooked up in a witch's lair while calling upon the name of a demon to make it work it's the same thing. 1 does it for money the other for power!

Strong's Number: 5332
Transliterated: pharmakeus
Phonetic: far-mak-yoos'
Text: from pharmakon (a drug, i.e. spell-giving potion); a druggist ("pharmacist") or poisoner, i.e. (by extension) a magician: --sorcerer.

21.
|2532| And
|3756| not
|3340| they did change their hearts
|1537| of
|3588| the
|5408| murders
|0846| of them
|3777| nor
|1537| of
|3588| the
|5331| sorceries,poisoner's, witchcraft
|0846| of them,
|3777| nor
|1537| of
|3588| the
|4202| sexual sins
|0846| of them
|3777| nor
|1537| of
|3588| the
|2809| thefts
|0846| of them.

[mark]

If you wish to discuss the HEBREW word Kashaph used in the OT then here is the place.
http://www.jesus-christ-forums.com/home/viewtopic.php?t=2238

We are speaking about the NT Greek Word pharmakeus and pharmakeia.

You should also re-read this entire thread and listen to what was said.

I did read the thread.
Having been a practicing Occultist for ~15 years.. I actually do have a
grip on what witchcraft is.
You need to understand that witchcraft has nothing to do with
chems or herbs...

you can play all the word games you wish and that will not change.
The dictates against witchcraft were originally written in Hebrew..
not Greek so going to the Greek is not really going to help your case
with me on this issue.


Now as to what you have written to Wigginsmum about doctors...
becoming poisoners for prescribing such meds over a long period
of time..

no.

The doctors are doing the best they can in the light of medical science...
their knowledge is not perfect.. most of them will tell you that if you ask.
they are human.
Doing the only thing they know to help someone is not being a 'poisoner'
it is trying to help people.

For the record I do not agree with some of the medical practices.. but that
hardly makes doctors evil.. it merely means they have gaps in their
knowledge.

now.. I have a particular bit of heartburn with this statement.

Rather created in a lab or cooked up in a witch's lair while calling upon the name of a demon to make it work it's the same thing. 1 does it for money the other for power!

1. I never had a 'lair'....

2. If you think that you can equate a bunsen burner with hellfire you
are seriously mistaken.

now.. I kinda like this board.. and I think it has a lot of potential.. lets
try to keep it thatway by not going off half-cocked here... okay?
I do understand that it is your board.. and I also gather that you
have a beef with some doctors... but that does not make them
witchs.. not by a long site.

mark

[wigginsmum]

Yeah, I have to say I agree with Mark on this one. There are doctors over-prescribing medicine, but it's got nothing at all to do with witchcraft.

Web, I'm still not entirely sure I understand what your point is, but I want to. I just think you're stretching to try and make it all fit into a cohesive whole and relying on someone's definition of witchcraft which doesn't hold water. But I appreciate your efforts to try and explain this.

Jules

[webmaster]

I have no beef with doctors.

Show me some solid evidence from before 100ad of what these words meant! Luke was a doctor so I am sure he knew exactly what they meant.
These words cover 2 sides. 1 side you wish to accept the other side you don't.

Strong's Number: 5332
Transliterated: pharmakeus
Phonetic: far-mak-yoos'
Text: from pharmakon (a drug, i.e. spell-giving potion); a druggist ("pharmacist") or poisoner, i.e. (by extension) a magician: --sorcerer.

Strong's Number: 5331
Transliterated: pharmakeia
Phonetic: far-mak-i'-ah
Text: from 5332; medication ("pharmacy"), i.e. (by extension) magic (literally or figuratively): --sorcery, witchcraft.

[mark]

If you wish to play the part of a fool and say that doctors are
practicing witchcraft....
A topic that you apparantly have no comprehension of....

you may go right ahead.... have a nice day.


mark

[webmaster]

For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.

But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

[webmaster]

Narcotics and hallucinogenic drugs were not uncommon in NT times.
For instance, the Oracles of Delphi apparently used *Datura* during their quests for visions. This is the scientific, Latin classification of Jimson weed. It contains powerful alkaloids (biochemical bases of vegetable origin which include many other drugs, quite a number of which have narcotic or hallucinogenic effects: e.g. mescaline, cocaine, morphine, etc., etc.).

In Carlos Casteneda's books about his anthropological research with a Yaqui Indian 'brujo' (Spanish for 'witch', or 'sorcerer'), we encounter Datura being employed for vision quests. The sorcerer also uses mescaline, and various other substances.

Now, the majority of people abusing drugs today aren't using the drugs as parts of deliberate supernatural rituals, but for 'recreation'.

The supernatural, however, is inescapable whether a person believes in it or not.

One form of worship today which doesn't seem like religion at first, but which is very common and which does in fact have supernatural significance, is Self. People love pleasures rather than God. When we are selfish it does no harm to God, it hurts us.

Much drug use today begins as a quest for self-absorbed pleasure, or escape. The drugs are not inherently evil in themselves. The evil emerges from unredeemed hearts and minds as they commit spiritual adultery.

The enemy tries to fuel these processes along, trying to bring people under physical, psychological and spiritual bondage. Satanists are often involved in chains of supply, and they are involved in two ways.

First of all, people covenanted with the evil one are often the actual suppliers of drugs. Noticed how it often happens that authorities arrest users, dealers and smugglers, but very seldom the actual, original suppliers? They seem 'protected', and are, by dark forces.

http://www.believersweb.org/view.cfm?ID=192

[webmaster]

Doesn't the Bible call marijuana "witchcraft?" Is my regular meditational use as a rasta considered sorcery by the Bible?
http://www.lionofzion.com/faq/78da33b1040000a3006e/Sorcery+(The+Pharmakeia+Argument).html


Drugs and Sorcery at the End of the Age
http://pw2.netcom.com/~horse/sorcery.html


Pharmakeia: The Abuse of Drugs
http://www.truthmagazine.com/archives/v ... 015091.htm

Paul in his epistle to the Galatians enumerated a concise list of the works of the flesh. Contained in that list is the Greek word, pharmakeia. The King James scholar translated pharmakeia as "witchcraft" but a more probable rendering is that of "sorcery" and is so given by the American Standard Version. Sorcery is far closer to the meaning of the term.

Pharmakeia (sorcery) is a form of the Greek root from which we get our English words pharmacy, pharmacist, and pharmaceutical. Pharmakeia (sorcery) fundamentally has to do with drugs or medicine. Originally the word was used only in the sense of medicine. Plato talked about the different kinds of medicinal treatment: cautery, incision, the use of drugs (pharmakeia), and even starvation. (Plato, Protagorus 354a). In the beginning, pharmakeia was a medical term; it had to do with the proper use of drugs.

Later pharmakeia took on an entirely different meaning. The learned William Barclay says that pharmakeia began "to denote the misuse of drugs, that is, the use of drugs to poison and not to cure. So we read about the law regarding poisoning (Plato, Laws 933 B), and Demosthenes accuses a bad man of poisoning and all kinds of villainy (Demosthenes 40.57). This is the beginning of the bad use of the word" (Flesh And Spirit, p. 36)

In the New Testament, pharmakeia carried with it the idea of sorcery, occultism, and black magic. It is in this sense that Paul used the term in Galatians 5.20. The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia clearly points out that "since the ideas we attach to 'witch' and 'witchcraft' were unknown in Bible times, the words (witch and witchcraft) have no right place in our' Eng. Bible..." (p. 3097). When Paul spoke of pharmakeia (witchcraft KJV) he certainly did not have in mind witches on broomsticks, black cats, and silly superstitions. The Apostle was speaking of sorcery -- the evil abuse of drugs.

The Greek scholar, W.E. Vine summarized the different uses of pharmakeia in his Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words. Said Vine of pharmakeia: "primarily signified the use of medicine, drugs, spells; then, poisoning; then sorcery." It is at this point the dark and grim fact of pharmakeia emerges. Pharmakeia literally is the abuse of drugs coupled with the occult. Pharmakeia is a chain connecting drug addiction with sorcery!

[webmaster]

2. SORCERY AND WITCHCRAFT. "Pharmakeia."

"Pharmakon," was a drug
and
"pharmakeia," the use of drugs.

The noun "pharmakeia" occurs in Gal.5v20. Rev.9v21. 18v23.. "Sorcerer," "pharmakus," occurs in Rev.21v8.; and "pharmakos," in Rev.22v15.. "Mageia," "sorceries," in Acts.8v11. and "mageuo," "sorcery," in Act8v9.. "Magos," is translated as "sorcerer" in Acts.13v6,8.; and the plural "magi," as "wise men" in Mt.2v1,7,16.

Sorcery and witchcraft in Paul's time were very similar to their modern equivalents; images of people were made and destroyed, and curses were put upon people by invoking the powers of darkness.

In Paul's time, magic, divination, astrology and the occult powers mentioned in Deut.18v10-22., were commonly practised. People were full of fear, and used amulets and charms in an effort to protect themselves from witchcraft, sorcery, magical spells and the evil eye.

The value of the books on magic burned in the revival at Corinth was about £50,000, which shows how rife magical practices were in Paul's time. Acts.19v19. These occult practices were one of the main obstacles to the spread of the Gospel in the early Church, and this is why miracles were needed to confirm the truth of the Gospel. Philip and Paul compelled the Gentiles to believe in Jesus, by doing greater miracles than the servants of Satan. Acts.8v4-13. 13v6-12. 18v11-20. Rom.15v18-21.

http://www.thesecretofeternallife.com/marriagee.html

A little background on "Pharmakeia" which is also a feminine noun that can be used collectively, it references the herbalist of the time who were almost always female. It was one of the few businesses available to single women, herbalism was complex so there was an aura of secrecy to it. They also were fond of saying incantations or using symbolic items etc to increase the "mystery" around their practice. It gave them both power and prestige, it would have also increased their incomes and perhaps the more mystical it appeared the greater price people were willing to pay for their "potions". These women challenged the authority structure of both Paul's church and the society of the time in general. The ability to heal, poison, abort fetuses, etc. gave them an incredible amount of power and would have created a diversion from God and Christianity. So, you have that aspect of that term used here.
Later, there are frequent references in church writings (not scripture) referring to abortionist using the term "pharmakeia". Outside of the church Plutarch uses the term pharmakeia in reference to contraception and abortion.
Clement of Alexandria identifies pharmakeia as an abortifacent.
An early church council in the capital of Galatia referenced adulterous woman who who avail themselves to pharmakeia for abortion.

Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words
an adjective signifying "devoted to magical arts," is used as a noun, "a sorcerer," especially one who uses drugs, potions, spells, enchantments, Rev. 21:8, in the best texts (some have pharmakeus), and Rev. 22:15.

Plato writes of Pharmakeia the Naias Nymphe of a poisonous spring near Athens, Orithyia is swept away by Boreas while she was playing with Pharmacia. Later Socrates compares the written texts Phaedrus has brought along to pharmakon, he describes it as both a cure and poison.

http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread ... 903&page=2

In the New Testament, sorcery is listed as a work of the flesh, which, if practiced, will keep a soul out of heaven (Galatians 5:20). Sorcery is from the Greek word pharmakeia. According to the Linguistic Key to the Greek New Testament, by Rienecker and Rogers, pharmakeia means "the use of medicine or drugs, the use of drugs for magical purposes, magic, sorcery" (517). In his Greek-English Lexicon, J.H. Thayer says it means "sorcery, magical arts" (649). In his Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words, W.E. Vine says pharmakeia "primarily signified the use of medicine, drugs, spells; then, poisoning; then, sorcery" (1074-1075). The term pharmakeia is a broad one that encompasses the use of recreational and illegal drugs, as well as magic, witchcraft, voodoo, superstition, astrology, fortune telling, horoscopes, sorcery and the like (many of these terms overlap).

http://www.gospelgazette.com/gazette/2004/jan/page8.htm

[webmaster]

Further evidence is found in the Didache, also called the Teachings of the Twelve Apostles, written about the year 80 A.D. This book was the Church's first manual of morals, liturgical norms and doctrine. In the first section? two ways are proposed: the way of life and the way of death. In following the way of life, the <Didache> exhorts, "
You shall not murder.
You shall not commit adultery.
You shall not seduce boys.
You shall not commit fornication.
You shall not steal.
You shall not practice magic.
You shall not use potions.
You shall not procure abortion, nor destroy a new-born child.
You shall not covet your neighbor's goods...."
Again, scholars link such phrases as "practice magic" and "use potions" with artificial birth control.

http://www.ewtn.com/library/ANSWERS/HISTCONT.HTM

[webmaster]

"And do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even EXPOSE THEM."
Ephesians 5:11

[webmaster]

It should be noted that prescription drugs do not heal, and in most cases simply mask the problem prolonging agony, never approaching the root cause of the disease. The sad fact is, most doctors today do not attempt to heal their patients, instead they prescribe drugs for pain management, keeping patients on a never ending drug merry-go-round. Toxic drug ingredients build up within the body and eventually cause damage to vital organs which leads to death. Basically, taking drugs = shorter lifespan.

According to the Washington Post on November 30, 1999 an article from Rick Weiss states:

As many as 98,000 Americans die unnecessarily every year from medical mistakes made by physicians, pharmacists and other health care professionals....."These stunningly high rates of medical errors, resulting in deaths, permanent disability and unnecessary suffering, are simply unacceptable in a medical system that promises first to "do no harm", said William C. Richardson, President of the W.K. Kellogg Foundation and chairman of the expert committee that compiled the blunt 223-page report.

In the USA Today December 4, 1999
Headline: Clinton orders task force today to find new ways to reduce deaths caused by medical mistakes.

WASHINGTON - President Clinton and members of Congress acting on a recommendation of Institute of Medicine form a task force to find out why 98,000 Americans are killed by medical mistakes. The report stated that more people are killed by medical mistakes than accidents, breast cancer, or AIDS. Mistakes include illegible prescriptions, nurses delivering the wrong doses and doctors misinterpreting symptoms. [End]

USA TODAY
FDA planning new ways to improve drug safety
by Lauren Neergaard - Associated Press

An estimated two million Americans are hospitalized annually from drug side effects, and 100,000 die.

WASHINGTON - New drugs are tested only a few hundred to a few thousand times before they are sold to millions, meaning rare side effects that don't show up in small clinical trials can wind up hurting hundreds of people. But doctors aren't required to report side effects to the FDA, which has only about 80 employees to monitor the more than 3000 prescription drugs sold... The FDA's approval process isn't strict enough. The agency has had to ban five drugs since September 1997; in the past decade, it banned just six others...

Still, experts say most side effect-caused deaths are preventable. Doctors may prescribe the wrong drug - sometimes confusing drugs with similar names - or wrong dose. The medicine may interact dangerously with another drug the patient takes... Doctors may not even know all the side effects. Time-strapped physicians may not fully read FDA-approved prescription labels, and it's hard to remember warnings for so many drugs.

http://azunimags.bigstep.com/generic52.html

[webmaster]

No Pain, No Gain


Maturing in life requires experiences which we do not always find pleasant. The current culture, however, considers it their right to find some mind altering drug that will take the pain away. Relief is just a minute away with the bottle, pill, white powder or smoke. That which we depend upon becomes our master. The desire to escape all unpleasantness results in a personality that is weak and faltering and dependent on something other than Christ for assistance. If we say we love God but depend on drugs for our emotional well-being, we are hypocritical. Whether a drug is deemed legal or illegal is irrelevant. Taking a drug to alter one’s consciousness is a form of sorcery. However, let us distinguish drugs that cause euphoria and diminish a person’s capacity to think realistically, from drugs that are used for legitimate medicinal purposes. There are many medicines that are a blessing to our world. For instance, heart medicines have prolonged the lives of many.


Drugs that are the equivalent to sorcery are drugs that are taken with the desire to be free of the burden of living – to find "relief" from the cares and pressures of the day. Relief should instead be found through prayer and praise and the study of the Word of God. This will move the Christian closer to God, rather than causing dependence on an herb or chemical. We are living a culture that in inculcated with drugs. America is a "drug" culture, even as it is a "sex" culture.

http://www.pursuingtheword.com/losing.htm

[webmaster]

Does Galatians 5:20 Condemn the Use of All Drugs?

The term could signify a drug.

Herodotus, the ancient Greek historian, tells of a man named Arcesilaus, who “fell sick,” and while “under the influence of a drug [pharmakon] which he had taken, was strangled” by one of his own brothers (IV.160).

http://www.christiancourier.com/questio ... estion.htm

The Greek New Testament and Septuagint on Witchcraft
Witchcraft occurs only once in the King James New Testament and sorcery twice--Galatians 5:20, Revelation 9:21 and 18:23. The word in the Greek New Testament in all three cases is pharmakeia, derived from the word pharmakon ("drug"), the source of the English word pharmacy and its cognates. The standard koiné Greek-English Lexicon translates the word as "sorcery" or "magic," but its cognate "sorcerer" (pharmakous) used in Revelation 21:8 and 22:15 is translated "mixer of poisons" as well as "magician." The root of both words, pharmakon, literally means "poison" or "drug."1

A few key Old Testament passages about witches which are often associated with the puritans such as Exodus 22:18 ("Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live"--KJV) use pharmakous in the Septuagint--the word translated sorcerer in Revelation 21:8 and 22:15.2 The Greek New Testament and the Septuagint version of the Hebrew Scriptures use different words such as mageia ("magic") when other types of occult practices like calling on spirits or using curses are meant. In English such words are usually translated "wizard," "necromancer," or some other appropriate word or phrase.2 Because of the Greek word chosen in each case, it appears that the New Testament authors and Septuagint translators understood the idea of witchcraft in terms of the use of drugs or poisons.

http://pages.cthome.net/jbair/realwit.htm

[webmaster]

II. PHARMAKEIA (witchcraft, sorcery, magic)

A. INFORMATION RELATED TO THIS WORD...
1. PHARMAKEIA is found to be used in three ways
a. Medically, to the use of drugs with no bad meaning at all
b. The misuse of drugs so as to poison, not cure
c. The practice of sorcery and witchcraft, which often used
drugs to cast spells and alter the behavior of others
2. The practice of witchcraft and sorcery is strongly condemned
in the Bible
a. In the Old Testament - Exo 22:18
b. In the New Testament - Re 21:8
3. In Ac 19:18-20, we find a remarkable example of repentance
related to the practice of magic

B. EXAMPLES OF THIS SIN TODAY...
1. There is an increasing number of religions based upon the
occult, and that make use of drugs in their religion
2. The "recreational" use of drugs also falls into this
category...
a. Remember that altering the behavior of others through such
drugs was a basic function of sorcery and witchcraft
b. What difference is there between using drugs to alter
others' behavior, and your own?
c. This is not to discount the proper medicinal use of drugs
d. But just as the Bible condemns drunkenness, which is an
altered state brought on by alcohol (a drug), so it would
seem to condemn similar use of other drugs

http://www.ccel.org/contrib/exec_outlines/fs/fs_04.htm

[webmaster]

The term pharmakeia is a broad one that encompasses the use of recreational and illegal drugs, as well as magic, witchcraft, voodoo, superstition, astrology, fortune telling, horoscopes, sorcery and the like (many of these terms overlap).

[mark]

Webmaster,

All you have done thus far is prove that which I already knew...
That there are many people who think they know what withccraft is
that haven't got a clue...
And when you hve a word that has been transliterated into so many
differant things you have to look at the context to determine the meaning.

In any cases the basic premise you began this thread with remains void..
even if pharmaceuticals were witchcraft.. and they are not....
it would be the people compounding the chemicals that are involved....
Unless, of course, you would consider everyone who takes drugs to be
involved in witchcraft...

If this is the case... enjoy your next caffienated beverage....
or perhaps your next antihistamine... or aspirin....

I am sincerely troubled by your line of reasoning.....


His servant,
mark

[webmaster]

I am curious Mark are you an Apostle? Have you seen Jesus Christ our Lord? It was Paul who was an Apostle that used the word pharmakeus / pharmakeia under the Power of the Holy Spirit for a reason. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. You are promoting un-righteousness!

[wigginsmum]

Why don't you just accept that you're attempting to justify a nonsensical argument, web? Doctors are not practising witchcraft by prescribing medicine - if you think they are, then you're really on the wrong track.

I'm bowing out of this thread now - have better things to do with my time than read stuff like this. Life's too short.

Jules

[mark]

I surrender.. I will take them all one at a time...
*sigh*
I got other things to do.

2. SORCERY AND WITCHCRAFT. "Pharmakeia."

"Pharmakon," was a drug
and
"pharmakeia," the use of drugs.

The noun "pharmakeia" occurs in Gal.5v20. Rev.9v21. 18v23.. "Sorcerer," "pharmakus," occurs in Rev.21v8.; and "pharmakos," in Rev.22v15.. "Mageia," "sorceries," in Acts.8v11. and "mageuo," "sorcery," in Act8v9.. "Magos," is translated as "sorcerer" in Acts.13v6,8.; and the plural "magi," as "wise men" in Mt.2v1,7,16.

you will note that in each of the translations the textual referances made
it inappropriate to equate it to drugs.

Sorcery and witchcraft in Paul's time were very similar to their modern equivalents; images of people were made and destroyed, and curses were put upon people by invoking the powers of darkness.

In Paul's time, magic, divination, astrology and the occult powers mentioned in Deut.18v10-22., were commonly practised. People were full of fear, and used amulets and charms in an effort to protect themselves from witchcraft, sorcery, magical spells and the evil eye.

remember this one.

pharmakeia "primarily signified the use of medicine, drugs, spells; then, poisoning; then, sorcery" (1074-1075). The term pharmakeia is a broad one that encompasses the use of recreational and illegal drugs, as well as magic, witchcraft, voodoo, superstition, astrology, fortune telling, horoscopes, sorcery and the like (many of these terms overlap).

http://www.gospelgazette.com/gazette/2004/jan/page8.htm

which is why you look at the way in which the word is used to determine
meaning

[mark]

Further evidence is found in the Didache, also called the Teachings of the Twelve Apostles, written about the year 80 A.D. This book was the Church's first manual of morals, liturgical norms and doctrine. In the first section? two ways are proposed: the way of life and the way of death. In following the way of life, the <Didache> exhorts, "
You shall not murder.
You shall not commit adultery.
You shall not seduce boys.
You shall not commit fornication.
You shall not steal.
You shall not practice magic.
You shall not use potions.
You shall not procure abortion, nor destroy a new-born child.
You shall not covet your neighbor's goods...."
Again, scholars link such phrases as "practice magic" and "use potions" with artificial birth control.

you skipped the fact that tehy seemed to have linked it with
murder... and adultery too... an oversite no doubt.

[mark]

I am curious Mark are you an Apostle?

no. I am a follower of Jesus who uses his knowledge and God-given
intelligence though.

Have you seen Jesus Christ our Lord?

nope.. met Him though..

It was Paul who was an Apostle that used the word pharmakeus / pharmakeia under the Power of the Holy Spirit for a reason.

exactly.. and He had it placed in the context He did to make it clear that
the meaning was magik

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. You are promoting un-righteousness!

Then perhaps you should stop trying to twist scripture from its' true
and proper meaning.
What I am promoting is that you stop this foolishness of trying to say
that Dr's are into witchcraft.... for that is bearing false witness upon
many many people.

mark

[mark]

One last item here for you Webmaster.

If medicine is witchcraft... why did Paul prescribe wine for Timothy's
ailment?

mark

[webmaster]

Galatians 5:19-20
Now the works of the flesh are manifest,
which are these;
Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, pharmakeia, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like:
of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past,
that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

19.
|5318| clearly revealed
|1161| Now
|2076| are
|3588| the
|2041| works
|3588| of the
|4561| flesh,
|3748| which
|2076| are:
|4202| sexual sin,
|0167| uncleanness,
|0766| lustfulness,
20.
|1495| idolatry,
|5331| pharmakeia,
|2189| hostilities,
|2054| fightings,
|2205| jealousies,
|2372| angers,
|2052| rivalries,
|1370| divisions,
|0139| heresies,
21.
|5355| envyings,
|3178| drunkennesses,
|2970| revellings,
|2532| and
|3664| similar things
|5125| to these,
|3739| which
|4302| I tell before
|5213| you,
|2531| as
|2532| also
|4280| I said previously,
|3754| that
|3588| those who
|5108| such things
|4238| are practicing
|9999| {the}
|0932| kingdom
|2316| of God
|3756| not
|2816| will inherit.


Revelation 9:20-21
And the rest of the men
which were not killed by these plagues
yet repented not of the works of their hands,
that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:

Neither repented they of
their murders,
nor of their pharmakeia,
nor of their fornication,
nor of their thefts.

20.
|2532| And
|3588| the
|3062| rest
|0444| of men,
|3739| who
|3756| not
|0615| were killed
|1722| by
|4127| plagues
|5025| these,
|3756| not
|3340| change their hearts
|1537| of
|3588| the
|2041| works
|3588| of the
|5495| hands
|0846| of them,
|2443| that
|3361| not
|4352| they will worship
|1140| demons
|2532| and
|1497| idols
|5552| gold
|2532| and
|0693| silver
|2532| and
|5470| bronze
|2532| and
|3035| stone
|2532| and
|3585| wood,
|3739| which
|3777| neither
|0991| to see
|1410| are able,
|3777| nor to
|0191| hear,
|3777| nor to
|4043| walk.
21.
|2532| And
|3756| not
|3340| they did change their hearts
|1537| of
|3588| the
|5408| murders
|0846| of them
|3777| nor
|1537| of
|3588| the
|5331| pharmakeia
|0846| of them,
|3777| nor
|1537| of
|3588| the
|4202| sexual sins
|0846| of them
|3777| nor
|1537| of
|3588| the
|2809| thefts
|0846| of them.

CHURCH FATHERS: The Didache
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/didache.html

Further evidence is found in the Didache, also called the Teachings of the Twelve Apostles, written about the year 80 A.D.

This book was the Church's first manual of morals, liturgical norms and doctrine.

In the first section?
two ways are proposed:
the way of life
and the way of death.

In following the way of life,
the <Didache> exhorts, "

You shall not murder.
You shall not commit adultery.
You shall not seduce boys.
You shall not commit fornication.
You shall not steal.
You shall not practice magic.
You shall not use potions.
You shall not procure abortion, nor destroy a new-born child.
You shall not covet your neighbor's goods...."

Again, scholars link such phrases as "practice magic" and "use potions" with artificial birth control.

you skipped the fact that tehy seemed to have linked it with
murder... and adultery too... an oversite no doubt.

The fact wasn't skipped neither was it an oversite, it backs up Galatians 5:19-20 & Revelation 9:20-21 which was written around the same time.

So pharmakeia has nothing to do with witchcraft(as we know it today) but does deals with exactly with what the word implies!

Strong's Number: 5332
Transliterated: pharmakeus
Phonetic: far-mak-yoos'
Text: from pharmakon (a drug, i.e. spell-giving potion); a druggist ("pharmacist") or poisoner, i.e. (by extension) a magician: --sorcerer.

Strong's Number: 5331
Transliterated: pharmakeia
Phonetic: far-mak-i'-ah
Text: from 5332; medication ("pharmacy"), i.e. (by extension) magic (literally or figuratively): --sorcery, witchcraft.

[webmaster]

Why don't you just accept that you're attempting to justify a nonsensical argument, web? Doctors are not practising witchcraft by prescribing medicine - if you think they are, then you're really on the wrong track.

I'm bowing out of this thread now - have better things to do with my time than read stuff like this. Life's too short.

Jules

Doctors who prescribes an addictive pain killer and gets the patient hooked is practicing pharmakeia!
People who take the pain pills and are addicted and know it are practicing pharmakeia!
People who smoke cigarettes are practicing pharmakeia!
The cigarette compaines who sells them are practicing pharmakeia!
People who are addicted to alcohol are practicing pharmakeia!
Drug dealers on the corner are practicing pharmakeia!
The Witch Doctors of old who mixed mercury into the medicine thinking it would cure but ended up killing 25% of the people in the village was practicing pharmakeia!
Doctors who perform an abortion are practicing pharmakeia!

The well-known Oath of Hippocrates (460-357 B.C.) includes a promise not to perform an abortion:

I swear by Apollo Physician, by Asclepius, by Health, by Panacea, and by all the gods and goddesses, making them my witnesses, that I will carry out, according to my ability and judgment, this oath and this indenture. . . . I will use treatment to help the sick according to my ability and judgment, but never with a view to injury and wrong-doing. Neither will I administer a poison to anybody when asked to do so, nor will I suggest such a course. Similarly, I will not give to a woman a pessary to cause abortion.(15)

The Didache maintained that there is a "great difference between these two ways." In expounding the second great commandment ("Love your neighbor as yourself") the author makes a list of "thou shalt not" statements. The list prohibits murder, adultery, sodomy, fornication, theft, the use of drugs (pharmakeia), infanticide, and abortion (2.2). The unborn child was considered a neighbor, against whom such things could not be done. Followers of the second way, the way of death, included those who practiced "medicine" (pharmakeia) and those who were "killers of the child, who abort the mold (plasma) of God."

http://www.tesm.edu/pubs/writings/wrap36ac



Ancient Mesopotamian Medicine
http://www.nanomedicine.com/NMI/1.2.1.2.htm

Practitioners were priests, and after 2000 BC, they were ruled by the strict laws included in the Code of Hammurabi listed below.

215 If a physician make a large incision with an operating knife and cure it, or if he open a tumor (over the eye) with an operating knife, and saves the eye, he shall receive ten shekels in money.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
216 If the patient be a freed man, he receives five shekels.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
217 If he be the slave of some one, his owner shall give the physician two shekels.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
218 If a physician make a large incision with the operating knife, and kill him, or open a tumor with the operating knife, and cut out the eye, his hands shall be cut off.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
219 If a physician make a large incision in the slave of a freed man, and kill him, he shall replace the slave with another slave.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
220 If he had opened a tumor with the operating knife, and put out his eye, he shall pay half his value.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
221 If a physician heal the broken bone or diseased soft part of a man, the patient shall pay the physician five shekels in money.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
222 If he were a freed man he shall pay three shekels.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
223 If he were a slave his owner shall pay the physician two shekels.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
224 If a veterinary surgeon perform a serious operation on an ass or an ox, and cure it, the owner shall pay the surgeon one-sixth of a shekel as a fee.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
225 If he perform a serious operation on an ass or ox, and kill it, he shall pay the owner one-fourth of its value.

Example of pharmakeia!
Mercury is extremely toxic and its curative effect is unproven!
The usefulness of mercury is limited by its poisonous nature and scarcity.

Mercury was among the first metals known, and its compounds have been used throughout history. Archaeologists found mercury in an Egyptian tomb dating from 1500 BC. The Egyptians and the Chinese may have been using cinnabar as a red pigment for centuries before the birth of Christ. In many civilizations mercury was used to placate or chase away evil spirits. The alchemists thought that mercury, which they associated with the planet Mercury, had mystical properties and used it in their attempts to transmute base metals into gold. The Greeks knew of mercury and used it as a medicine. Mercury and mercury compounds were used from about the 15th century to the mid 20th century to cure syphilis. Because mercury is extremely toxic and its curative effect is unproven, other syphilis medicines are now used. The usefulness of mercury is limited by its poisonous nature and scarcity.

http://www.herbs2000.com/homeopathy/merc.htm
http://www.campusprogram.com/reference/ ... nt__1.html

[webmaster]

So pharmakeia has nothing to do with witchcraft but does deals with exactly with what the word implies!

Witchcraft falls under idolatry and sorcery!

Wicca, the religion
http://www.religioustolerance.org/witchcra.htm

THE INNER SANCTUM OF WICCA & WITCHCRAFT
http://www.witchway.net/

Idolatry
Strong's Number: 1495
Transliterated: eidololatreia
Phonetic: i-do-lol-at-ri'-ah
Text: from 1497 and 2999; image-worship (literally or figuratively): --idolatry.


Sorcery

Strong's Number: 3095
Transliterated: mageia
Phonetic: mag-i'-ah
Text: from 3096; "magic": --sorcery.

Strong's Number: 3096
Transliterated: mageuo
Phonetic: mag-yoo'-o
Text: from 3097; to practice magic: --use sorcery.

Strong's Number: 3097
Transliterated: magos
Phonetic: mag'-os
Text: of foreign origin [7248]; a Magian, i.e. Oriental scientist; by implication a magician: --sorcerer, wise man.

Acts 8:9-11
9.
|0435| a man
|1161| And
|5100| certain
|3686| by name
|4613| Simon
|4391| had long been
|1722| in
|3588| the
|4172| city
|3096| conjuring(sorcery)
|2532| and
|1839| amazing
|3588| the
|1484| nation
|4540| of Samaria,
|3004| saying
|1511| to be
|5100| someone
|1438| himself
|3173| great,
10.
|3739| to whom
|4337| paid attention to
|3956| all
|0575| from
|3398| unimportant
|2193| to
|3173| important,
|3004| saying,
|3778| This one
|2076| is
|3588| the
|1411| power
|3588| of
|2316| God
|3173| great!
11.
|4337| they were heeding
|1161| And
|0846| him,
|1223| because
|2425| for a long
|5550| time
|3588| with the
|3095| conjuring(sorcery)
|9999| {he}
|1839| had amazed
|0846| them.

[webmaster]

Thread Locked since everybody is either too blind and don't care enough to search for the truth!

But I know one thing for sure, the truth revealed here has shown me that smoking cigarettes is a sin! With that I shall stop!