Aineo wrote:You are posting the same type of ignorant hate you accuse Christians of disseminating. I have not turned my back on the gay community and I do not insist any gay man or lesbian woman change their sexual orientation. This is nothing more than your own prejudice over riding truth. I cannot force and “preach” anyone into changing their lives; that is a personal decision.

What is the source of your hate?

Logic has nothing to do with your comment about prayer. Prayer is part of a life of faith so according to you all faithful people who pray are scoundrels. You just judged 90% of the earths population based on your own hate filled prejudice.

there is no hate and there is no ignorance and there is no prejudice, its simply a difference of opinion. you cannot force or "preach" anyone into changing anything, true enough, but why bother them at all? do you see gays bothering you to the same extent? no. and it is happening because of the bloody bible. that book has caused more grief to more people than probably any other religious tome in the history of the world.

there is no hate. there is a reasonable bewilderment however at why some people feel it necessary to shove their beliefs down the throats of others and evangelical christians amongst others are guilty on that count. they don't live and let live. they live and judge others by their own beliefs rather than accept and love them for exactly who they are because that takes courage and balls. evangelicals want to change everyone into clones of themselves, they deny people the inherent right to live as they see fit. they damn them and belittle them and frighten them with hellish visions if they do not comply. what the hell is that about? how cruel and meanspirited to do that to another human being.

i think there should be an evangelical gay movement that goes around preaching homosexuality and prays for heterosexuals to see the way and wakes people up at 9am on a saturday morning to spread the word. i would love to see that. shame that homosexuals have too much respect for other people's beliefs and sexual persuasions to do that, huh?

you totally twisted my words. i made it clear that i don't believe that prayer is ONLY the refuge of scoundrels. i think it has many positive benefits for a great many people. prayer and faith is something i have tremendous respect for and would never dream of belittling it anymore than i would dream of telling those who pray that they are "ill" or that their faith is a "crutch". it might be true, it might not be, depending on which side of the fence you're coming from, but nevertheless, i won't and do not interfere with the beliefs of others because it is simply not the right thing to do. wouldn't you agree? it shows a marked lack of respect for other human beings and their right to live their lives as they see fit and as best they can. there are these things called gay christians, go figure. i let them be even if i think their belief is incredibly illogical. its called acceptance. you might have heard of it.

you know, even when friends are beaten up i don't go looking to find the people that did it and beat the hell out of them right back, nor would i badger them into not doing it anymore if i did find them. the only question i would have is "why". mostly, i just accept that they are lost or at a stage where they don't know any better or think that maybe their lives have been shaped by forces that have brought them to this violence and i hope the police find them and take them off the streets. instead, i focus on looking after my friends and community as best i can. experience has shown me that everyone finds their own way in their own time. its not something that can be forced. i believe that the people that do inflict violence on homosexuals, or heterosexuals for that matter, will eventually realise what they are doing is wrong and if they don't, that's just how it is and i accept that as best i can. incarceration doesn't work. i don't go out and try to actively find them and change them. they will change when they're ready or able to, in their own way and in their own time. or not. so be it. they're not my business. let the dead look after the dead. my business is helping my friends recover. hate or badgering someone to change who is not ready to change is just wasted energy that could be put to better use assisting one owns community. do not cast your pearls before swine. if i am that swine, so be it. walk away.

everyone is stuggling in this life, Aineo. everybody. be that you, me, the cat down the street or the prostitute on the street corner. everyone is doing the best they can do in the best way they know how given whatever tools they have. sure you can suggest, and maybe that is all you do, but to repeatedly badger, cajole, demand, tear down and use guilt and fear as a battering ram is crossing personal boundaries and is intolerance in action.

people may not live the life you think they should live and so be it. they are living according to themselves and their own experience and they will find their own way as they go. that is all any of us can do and it is our right to do so. if you act from true motivation, and i believe you do, all you can do is suggest and leave. if they want to know more they can come to you but you can't and should not force it or use guilt or fear as a motivator. everyone feels guilty and fearful enough. the world doesn't need anymore of it. personally, i hope people don't come to you because i think you are negating people and damping down their innate spirit, the same spirit i try to keep alight, but its their choice. not mine and not yours.

understanding and respecting the peaceful beliefs and lifestyles of others creates a more bearable and tolerant world for all concerned. tearing down the beliefs and lifestyles of others does not.