Jesus is God
Who wrote the Fourth Gospel and why is it so different from the others?
To take the second question first as to the reason for the style of the fourth Gospel we must of course first recognise that it bears the imprint of its author. He it was who selected the material he wished to use and who commented upon it.
Furthermore he wrote so much later than the other Gospel writers that he almost certainly knew of the existence of the other Gospels, and of their contents. Thus the difference arises from the writers purpose, and the different incidents he recalled, which fitted in with that purpose.
But this is not to suggest that he changed the material to suit his philosophy. The material in John's Gospel is clearly connected with a Hebraistic background, and it is not changed to suit the convenience of the writer. Furthermore we now know that the so-called Greek ideas (such as the logos) were widely used in Palestine at the time. The concepts are thus Palestinian. What is probable is that he had in mind materials that he knew would be helpful to his readers with their own Greek background.
However a reading of the Gospel makes very clear that it has to be placed squarely in the setting which is revealed by the other Gospels. John does not make specific use of these but his account refers briefly, and often indirectly, to matters which only make sense against the background of the other Gospels. The Galilean ministry is a case in point. John is concerned with Jesus' activity in Jerusalem and the surrounding area but he says sufficient to show that he was aware of an extensive Galilean ministry, although he virtually ignores it.
The fact however is that the author gives us a whole new perspective on Jesus. He deals with arguments with Jewish leaders and teachers which are barely dealt with in the Synoptics (although clearly implied in some of Jesus teaching there) which suggests that he was of a type who took great interest in such teaching, in contrast with those who remembered 'sermons' but did not enter fully into disputation. As in fact Jesus must have had arguments with these parties it is clear that John is filling us in with material that the other Gospel writers for one reason or another neglected.
He obviously had a great interest in Jerusalem and Jesus attitude to the Temple and its authorities, and was almost certainly related to the Jewish hierarchy in some way (18.15), which explains his interest in this aspect of the life of Jesus. The whole Gospel bears the stamp of his personality in the type of incident he brings to mind and the detailed conversations he remembers.
Furthermore the Gospel is full of incidental things which confirm that he was an eyewitness to the events that took place. He remembers almost incidentally the time at which events took place, the places at which they occurred, and significant details relating to events which demonstrate his vivid memory of those events. He was 'the disciple whom Jesus loved' and 'sat' (lay on a kind of mattress) next to Jesus at the last supper (21.20).
So important were his words seen to be that early church leaders wrote a superscription to confirm his authority (21.24).
His position at the last supper points conclusively to one of the inner band of disciples and it is John with whom the early church always associated it. There is nothing in the Gospel to repudiate this idea, and the fact that John is not mentioned in the Gospel, and that John the Baptiser is simply called John would seem strong support for it.
Hunter lists three reasons why, in his opinion, John could not have written the Gospel.
· 1. A disciple would not have used Mark and Luke like the writer 'obviously did'.
· 2. Difference in style. In the Synoptics Jesus speaks with a wealth of parables, while John has long, mystical discourses but no parables.
· 3. It is unlikely that the Apostle John would style himself 'the disciple whom Jesus loved'.
However these are doubtful arguments. Firstly we have no real grounds for thinking that the writer did directly use Mark and Luke. He only shows a similar general background. There is no definite connection. And anyway, as they were accepted by the early church as authoritative, he would have every reason to use them either directly or indirectly. Use of other peoples materials was not frowned on then.
Secondly, the parables were mainly used with the sympathetic 'common folk' while in John the discourses are to the intelligensia. In any case, the Gospel of John does have parabolic material, of a kind well suited to the intelligensia, as C H Dodd among others has pointed out.
And thirdly, the term 'the disciple whom Jesus loved' could be looked on as humble wonder at the amazing fact, rather than a claim to a special position. From this point of view there is no difficulty in the title. Someone coined the title, and it has difficulties whoever we suggest as the author. An awed humility is the best way of interpreting it.
Howard claims that the lack of mention of special events when John was present e.g. the transfiguration and the garden of gethsemane, count against his authorship, but that is to make assumptions which are not fully valid. Who can say what someone would include when they are writing with a specific purpose in mind? The writer clearly emphasises the spiritual aspect of Jesus life and teaching, which he may not have thought best conveyed by such events. We may well ask, would someone else who wrote about Jesus and the disciples have so assiduously ignored John, and so specifically excluded such important and well known events.
In favour of the suggestion that John wrote the Gospel is the statement that it was written by the disciple who lay in Jesus' bosom, the favoured place at the Last Supper, the fact that John the Apostle is never named in the Gospel and that John the Baptiser is named simply 'John' with no thought of distinguishing him from the disciple, (unlikely if the Gospel was written by another, especially an admirer of John).
Also significant is that no one in the second century church, whether Christian or heretic, ever considered the Gospel to have been written by anyone else.
Certainly the writer is a Jew who knows intimately the details of the Jewish religion, and the fact that he is an eyewitness comes out again and again in incidental references.
John owned his own fishing business, and his mother sought high places for him and his brother, which would tie in with his being from an important family. There is therefore no reason why he should not be connected to the Jewish hierarchy and interested in events relating to them. It can well be argued that it was this connection that meant that he would remember events which took place in Jerusalem at a time when the other disciples were too awed to be taking so much notice of the events.
There would appear to be sound reasons for recognising that the Gospel was written by John.
Now about Jesus as God
1. There is one true God of the Bible
2. He is identified as Father, Son, Holy Spirit
3. The Father <> The Son <> Holy Spirit.
Do we find the Trinity in the Old Testament?
Argument: Trinity cannot be true because its incomprehensible.
However, the Bible says that God is incomprehensible.
Our inability to understand a quality of God doesnt mean that the quality does not exist.
Thats what we would expect to find!
We should expect that Gods nature wouldnt make sense to us.
Any god that we could fully understand and explain would be less than we are.
Because the Bible says that God is incomprehensible, we would expect to find that his nature is incomprehensible to his creation.
Thus, the fact that the trinity doesnt make sense logically is actually proof that it is true. Because its consistent with the incomprehensibility of the nature of God.
Bible says God is incomprehensible
Job 5:8 "But as for me, I would seek God, And I would place my cause before God; 9 Who does great and unsearchable things, Wonders without number.
Job 9:10 Who does great things, unfathomable, And wondrous works without number. 11 "Were He to pass by me, I would not see Him; Were He to move past me, I would not perceive Him. 12 "Were He to snatch away, who could restrain Him? Who could say to Him, 'What are You doing?'
Romans 11:33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways!
No one can completely understand God. If someone could, he would become his counselor because hed be greater than God.
Argument: I don't believe what I cant understand!
Then you must reject the love of Christ because:
Ephesians 3:19 and to know the love of Christ which surpasses knowledge, that you may be filled up to all the fullness of God.
Moreover, you'd have to reject that there is a peace of God:
NAU Philippians 4:7 And the peace of God, which surpasses all comprehension, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.
The incomprehensibility of the Trinity is not an argument against it, but for it!
Part 1 - There is one true God of the Bible
There is only one God.
We do not believe that there are 3 Gods. This is tritheism which is really polytheism.
If there is only 1 God, what would we expect to find?
1. We'd expect to find in the Bible where God himself says He alone is God
2. The gods of other religions are false gods
3. Prophets, priests and apostles should state that there is only one God
God says there is only one God.
Deuteronomy 32:39
'See now that I, I am He, And there is no god besides Me; It is I who put to death and give life. I have wounded and it is I who heal, And there is no one who can deliver from My hand.
Isaiah 43:10
"You are My witnesses," declares the LORD, "And My servant whom I have chosen, So that you may know and believe Me And understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, And there will be none after Me.
Isaiah 44:6
"Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel And his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: 'I am the first and I am the last, And there is no God besides Me.
Isaiah 44:8b
'And you are My witnesses. Is there any God besides Me, Or is there any other Rock? I know of none.'"
Isaiah 45:5-6
"I am the LORD, and there is no other; Besides Me there is no God. I will gird you, though you have not known Me; That men may know from the rising to the setting of the sun That there is no one besides Me. I am the LORD, and there is no other
Isaiah 45:18b
I am the LORD, and there is none else.
Isaiah 45:21-22
"Declare and set forth your case; Indeed, let them consult together. Who has announced this from of old? Who has long since declared it? Is it not I, the LORD? And there is no other God besides Me, A righteous God and a Savior; There is none except Me. "Turn to Me and be saved, all the ends of the earth; For I am God, and there is no other.
Prophets, Kings, Priests and Apostles state there is only one God
2 Samuel 7:22
For this reason You are great, O Lord GOD; for there is none like You, and there is no God besides You
1 Kings 8:60
so that all the peoples of the earth may know that the LORD is God; there is no one else.
1 Chronicles 17:20
"O LORD, there is none like You, nor is there any God besides You, according to all that we have heard with our ears.
Isaiah 37:16
"O LORD of hosts, the God of Israel, who is enthroned above the cherubim, You are the God, You alone, of all the kingdoms of the earth. You have made heaven and earth.
Isaiah 45:14
Surely, God is with you, and there is none else, No other God.
Jeremiah 10:6
There is none like You, O LORD
Jeremiah 10:7
There is none like You.
The evidence is so overwhelming that even the demons understand theres one God.
James 2:19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe -- and tremble!
Hes called the only true God; All other gods are false
2 Chronicles 15:3
"For many days Israel was without the true God and without a teaching priest and without law.
Jeremiah 10:10
But the LORD is the true God;
John 17:3
"This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.
1 Thessalonians 1:9
For they themselves report about us what kind of a reception we had with you, and how you turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God,
Hes called the only eternal God
Isaiah 40:28 Do you not know? Have you not heard? The Everlasting God, the LORD, the Creator of the ends of the earth Does not become weary or tired. His understanding is inscrutable.
Gen 21:33; Deut. 32:27; Isa. 40:28; Jer. 10:10; Rom. 16:26; 1 Tim. 1:11
Hes called the living God; All other gods are lifeless
Psalm 42:2
My soul thirsts for God, for the living God; When shall I come and appear before God?
Psalm 84:2
My soul longed and even yearned for the courts of the LORD; My heart and my flesh sing for joy to the living God.
Jeremiah 10:10-12
But the LORD is the true God; He is the living God and the everlasting King 11 Thus you shall say to them, "The gods that did not make the heavens and the earth will perish from the earth and from under the heavens." 12 It is He who made the earth by His power, Who established the world by His wisdom; And by His understanding He has stretched out the heavens.
Deut 5:26; Josh. 3:10; 1 Sam. 17:26,36; 2 Kings 19:4,16; Isa. 37:4; Jer. 23:36; Dan. 6:26; Hos. 1:10; Matt. 16:16; 26:63; Acts 14:15; 1 Thess. 1:9; Heb. 3:12
Conclusion:
There is only one, true, eternal, living Being who is God by nature and Maker of heaven and earth.
Part 2 - God is identified as Father, Son, Holy Spirit
The Father is God
He is called God
Almost goes without saying. For sake of an exhaustive study, lets prove it.
The word qeo,j is used of the Father
Galatians 1:1 Paul, an apostle (not sent from men, nor through the agency of man, but through Jesus Christ, and (qeou/ patro.j) God the Father, who raised Him from the dead),
NAS 2 John 1:3 Grace, mercy and peace will be with us, from (qeou/ patro.j) God the Father and from Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, in truth and love.
Etc.
Attributes of the Father reveal He is God
He is describes as:
· Eternal
(Rom. 1:20) His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen
· Omnipotent
(Rev. 19:6) "Hallelujah! For the Lord our God, the Almighty, reigns
· Immortal
(1 Tim. 1:17) Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, to God who alone is wise, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen
· Omniscient
(Matt. 6:32) He knows what we want before we ask.
· Holy
(1 Pet. 1:15) as He who called you is holy, you also be holy;
· Perfect
Matthew 5:48 ...be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect
Works of the Father reveal He is God
· He creates
(Heb 3:4) He who built all things is God
· He is sovereign
(Matt. 11:25) Hes called the Lord of heaven and earth
· He saves
(Isa. 45:21) there is no other God besides Me, A just God and a Savior; There is none besides Me.
The Father Is Worshipped As God
We give our
· Faith
· Hope
· Love
· Obedience
To Him (Matt. 5:16; 6:9-13; John 4:23-24; Eph. 3:14; Phil. 4:20; Rev. 4:9-11, etc.)
The Son is God
The same method we used to prove that the Father is God can be used to prove that the Son is God.
The Son is called God
The Bible says Jesus is qeo.j!
John 1:1 VEn avrch/| h=n o` lo,goj( kai. o` lo,goj h=n pro.j to.n qeo,n( kai. qeo.j h=n o` lo,gojÅ
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
He’s the only true God
1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God has come, and has given us understanding, in order that we might know Him who is true, and we are in Him who is true, in His Son (VIhsou/ Cristw/|Å ou-to,j evstin o` avlhqino.j qeo.j kai. zwh. aivw,nioj) Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life.
Bible says hes all the fullness of Deity bodily:
Colossians 2:9 For in Him (katoikei/ pa/n to. plh,rwma th/j qeo,thtoj swmatikw/j) all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form, 10 and in Him you have been made complete, and He is the head over all rule and authority;
Attributes of the Son reveal He is God
Jesus is:
· Eternal
(John 1:2) He was in the beginning with God
· Omnipotent
(Rev. 19:16) He's called KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.
· Omniscient
(John 16:30) You know all things, and have no need for anyone to question You
· Omnipresent
(Matt. 18:20) For where 2 or 3 have gathered together in My name, there I am in their midst.
· Holy
(John 6:69) You are the Holy One of God
· Immutable
(Heb 1:11-12) They will perish, but You remain But You are the same, And Your years will not fail."
Works of the Son reveal He is God
He creates
John 1:3 All things came into being by Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
NAS Colossians 1:15 And He is the (eivkw.n) image of the invisible God, the (prwto,tokoj) first-born of all creation. 16 For by Him all things (ta. pa,nta) were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities--all things have been created (diV auvtou/ kai. eivj auvto.n) by Him and for Him.
NKJ Isaiah 44:24 Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, And He who formed you from the womb: "I am the LORD, who makes all things, Who stretches out the heavens all alone, Who spreads abroad the earth by Myself;
Hebrews 3:4 For every house is built by someone, but the builder of all things is God.
He is sovereign
Revelation 19:16 And on His robe and on His thigh He has a name written, "KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS." (Basileu.j basile,wn kai. ku,rioj kuri,wnÅ)
He saves
NKJ John 4:42 Then they said to the woman, "Now we believe, not because of what you said, for we ourselves have heard Him and we know that this is indeed the Christ, the Savior of the world."
Isaiah 43:11 "I, even I, am the LORD; And there is no savior besides Me.
Hosea 13:4 Yet I have been the LORD your God Since the land of Egypt; And you were not to know any god except Me, For there is no savior besides Me.
The Son Is Worshipped As God
Revelation 5:8 the elders fell down before the Lamb
saying, "Worthy art Thou
"Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power and riches and wisdom and might and honor and glory and blessing to the Lamb, be blessing and honor and glory and dominion forever and ever." 14 And the four living creatures kept saying, "Amen." And the elders fell down and worshiped.
The Holy Spirit is God
The same method we used to prove that the Father and Son are God can be used to prove that the Holy Spirit is God.
The Holy Spirit is called God
Acts. 28:25
Acts 28:25 And when they did not agree with one another, they began leaving after Paul had spoken one parting word, "The Holy Spirit rightly spoke through Isaiah the prophet to your fathers, 26 saying, 'Go to this people and say, "You will keep on hearing, but will not understand; And you will keep on seeing, but will not perceive; 27 For the heart of this people has become dull, And with their ears they scarcely hear, And they have closed their eyes; Lest they should see with their eyes, And hear with their ears, And understand with their heart and return, And I should heal them."'
Hes referring to Isaiah 6 where Isaiah sees YHVH high and lifted up:
Isaiah 6:8 Then I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, "Whom shall I send, and who will go for Us?" Then I said, "Here am I. Send me!" 9 And He said, "Go, and tell this people: 'Keep on listening, but do not perceive; Keep on looking, but do not understand.' 10 "Render the hearts of this people insensitive, Their ears dull, And their eyes dim, Lest they see with their eyes, Hear with their ears, Understand with their hearts, And return and be healed."
Isaiah says the Lord YHVH was speaking and Paul says that the Holy Spirit was speaking.
Hebrews 10:15-17
Hebrews 10:15 And the Holy Spirit also bears witness to us; for after saying, 16 "This is the covenant that I will make with them After those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws upon their heart, And upon their mind I will write them," He then says, 17 "And their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more."
Quotes from Jeremiah 31:31-34 where YHVH is speaking
Jeremiah 31:31 "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD (YHVH)
Attributes of the Holy Spirit reveal He is God
Eternal
Hebrews 9:14 how much more will the blood of Christ, who (dia. pneu,matoj aivwni,ou) through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without blemish to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
Omniscient
NKJ Isaiah 40:13 Who has directed the Spirit of the LORD, Or as His counselor has taught Him? 14 With whom did He take counsel, and who instructed Him, And taught Him in the path of justice? Who taught Him knowledge, And showed Him the way of understanding?
Omnipotent
Continuing in Isaiah 40
15 Behold, the nations are as a drop in a bucket, And are counted as the small dust on the scales; Look, He lifts up the isles as a very little thing.
Omnipresent
2 Corinthians 13:14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all.
How can the Holy Spirit have fellowship with all believers at the same time? Hes omnipresent.
Holy
He is called the Holy Spirit (to. pneu/ma to. a[gion). (Mark 3:29)
Works of the Holy Spirit reveal He is God
He creates
Job 33:4 "The Spirit of God has made me, And the breath of the Almighty gives me life.
Genesis 1:2 And the earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep; and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters.
Word for was moving is similar to an eagle hovering over its young in the nest. Its a participle and indicates continuous action.
He is sovereign
Isa 40:13 Who has directed the Spirit of the LORD
15 Behold, the nations are as a drop in a bucket, And are counted as the small dust on the scales; Look, He lifts up the isles as a very little thing.
He saves
2 Thessalonians 2:13 But we should always give thanks to God for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God has chosen you from the beginning (eivj swthri,an) for salvation (evn a`giasmw/| pneu,matoj) through sanctification by the Spirit and faith in the truth.
The Holy Spirit Is Worshipped As God
2 Corinthians 13:14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the (h` koinwni,a tou/ a`gi,ou pneu,matoj) fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all.
Whatever fellowship is applied to the Father also should be applied to the Holy Spirit.
Conclusion To Part 2
Thus, God is identified as Father, Son, Holy Spirit
Part 3 Each member is distinct from the other.
Modalism
Says that the is only one person manifesting himself in 3 different ways.
In this way, the Father takes on the Role of Jesus at times, and at other times, He takes on the role of the Holy Spirit.
Aka. Sabelleianism, the Jesus Only Movement, Oneness Pentecostalism.
Jesus is not the Father
John 8:13 Jews challenge Jesus
John 8:13 The Pharisees therefore said to Him, "You are bearing witness of Yourself; Your witness is not true."
Jesus responded by saying that:
According to Deuteronomy 19:15, the testimony of two or three witnesses is sufficient to establish truth.
In this case, he was one witness and his Father was the second witness:
John 8:16 "But even if I do judge, My judgment is true; for I am not alone in it, but I and He who sent Me. 17 "Even in your law it has been written, that the testimony of two men is true. 18 "I am He who bears witness of Myself, and the Father who sent Me bears witness of Me."
If modalism were true, Jesus is a liar. He and the Father would be the same person and there are not two witnesses, but one!
John 14:23-26 Jesus words were not his own
John 14:23 Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him, and make Our abode with him. 24 "He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father's who sent Me. 25 "These things I have spoken to you, while abiding with you. 26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.
Couple of things in this verse:
· The word which Jesus spoke was not His word, but the Fathers. He cannot be the Father.
· He and the Father are a we and our relationship.
Matthew 5 The Father was in Heaven while Jesus was on earth
5:48 "Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
o` path.r u`mw/n o` ouvra,nioj te,leio,j evstinÅ
Lit. the Father of us, the heavenly
5:16 "Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven.
doxa,swsin to.n pate,ra u`mw/n to.n evn toi/j ouvranoi/jÅ
While Jesus was speaking these Words, he said that the Father was in the Heavens. Hed be lying if he were the Father.
Jesus sits at the right hand of the Father
Hebrews 1:13 But to which of the angels has He ever said, "Sit at My right hand, Until I make Thine enemies A footstool for Thy feet "?
Father addresses the Son, telling Him to sit down at His right hand for a duration of time. Thus, for this duration, you have the Father and the Son at the right hand. They are two persons.
Jesus will confess men before his Father
Revelation 3:5 'He who overcomes shall thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father, and before His angels (evnw,pion tou/ patro,j mou kai. evnw,pion tw/n avgge,lwn auvtou/Å).
Friberg Lexicon:
[Fri] evnw,pion in sight or in front; (1) in front of; (2) doing something in someone's presence in the presence of, in the sight of, before;
How can the Son confess you and I before the Father, and still be the Father? They are two distinct persons.
Jesus prayed to the Father
Matthew 11:25 At that time Jesus answered and said, (VExomologou/mai, soi( pa,ter( ku,rie tou/ ouvranou/ kai. th/j gh/j) "I praise Thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that Thou didst hide these things from the wise and intelligent and didst reveal them to babes.
Is Jesus deceiving us, or is there really a Father in heaven listening to his prayer here?
John 5:30 Jesus was obedient to the Father
Jesus came to do the will of the Father:
John 5:30 "I can do nothing on My own initiative. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is just, because I (ouv zhtw/ to. qe,lhma to. evmo.n) do not seek My own will, but (to. qe,lhma tou/ pe,myanto,j me) the will of Him who sent Me.
This is why it was said that he became obedient.
Philippians 2:8 And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.
If Jesus were the Father, wouldnt he have come to do His own will?
Jesus is not the Holy Spirit
The Holy Spirit is Another Helper
John 14:16 "And I will ask the Father, and He will give you (a;llon para,klhton) another Helper, that He may be with you forever;
Word translated another is a;llon:
a;lloj( h( o another of the same kind, as opposed to e[teroj, another of a different kind or form.
If the Spirit were another helper, He cannot be the same Helper. Thus, there are two Helpers.
Holy Spirit will Glorify Jesus
John 16:14 "He shall glorify Me; for He shall take of Mine, and shall disclose it to you.
If Jesus were the Holy Spirit, why didn't Jesus say the Holy Spirit would glorify Himself?
Luke 3:22 - The Holy Spirit descends upon Jesus
Luke 3:22 and the Holy Spirit descended upon Him in bodily form like a dove, and a voice came out of heaven, "Thou art My beloved Son, in Thee I am well-pleased."
You have the Holy Spirit interacting with Jesus. They are clearly two distinct persons.
Biblical Grammar Teaches Distinction
Math 28:19 - Jesus says all 3 persons are distinct
Matthew 28:19 "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,
eivj to. o;noma tou/ patro.j kai. tou/ ui`ou/ kai. tou/ a`gi,ou pneu,matoj
If all 3 are the same person, then Jesus would seem to be a poor communicator.
2 Corinthians 13:14 Implies 3 Persons
2 Corinthians 13:14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all.
~H ca,rij tou/ kuri,ou VIhsou/ Cristou/ kai. h` avga,ph tou/ qeou/ kai. h` koinwni,a tou/ a`gi,ou pneu,matoj meta. pa,ntwn u`mw/nÅ
Romans 15:30 Greek grammar proves they are distinct
Romans 15:30 Now I urge you, brethren, (dia. tou/ kuri,ou h`mw/n VIhsou/ Cristou/ kai. dia. th/j avga,phj tou/ pneu,matoj) by our Lord Jesus Christ and by the love of the Spirit, to strive together with me in your prayers to God for me
Conclusion:
1. There is one true God of the Bible
2. He is identified as Father, Son, Holy Spirit
3. The Father <> The Son <> Holy Spirit.
A person is:
· Conscious of self
· Conscious of others
· Intellect
· Emotions
· Will
Bible describes God as a person
What we mean is:
· Describes him as a living Being, not as an impersonal force or
· He is aware of His own existence and can say
· He's conscious of the universe He's created.
· He clearly has emotions, intellect and will.
· He can be prayed to because He can hear and respond.
If each person of the Godhead is a distinct person as we propose, we would expect to find that these same things can be said of the Holy Spirit.
God the Holy Spirit is a Person
He can be grieved
Isaiah 63:10 But they rebelled And grieved His Holy Spirit; Therefore, He turned Himself to become their enemy, He fought against them.
The verb grieve here means to feel profound hurt, pain and grief.
Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve (mh. lupei/te) the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
You can't grieve an impersonal force.
He can hear
John 16:13 "But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.
He speaks
Mark 13:11 "And when they arrest you and deliver you up, do not be anxious beforehand about what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour; for it is not you who speak, but it is the Holy Spirit.
He helps and comforts
NAS John 16:7 "But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the (o` para,klhtoj) Helper (Comforter) shall not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you.
He forbids
NAS Acts 16:6 And they passed through the Phrygian and Galatian region, having been forbidden by the Holy Spirit to speak the word in Asia; 7 and when they had come to Mysia, they were trying to go into Bithynia, and the Spirit of Jesus did not permit them
He intercedes
NAS Romans 8:26 And in the same way the Spirit also helps our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we should, but the Spirit Himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words;
He chooses and sends
Acts 13:2 And while they were ministering to the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, "Set apart for Me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them." 3 Then, when they had fasted and prayed and laid their hands on them, they sent them away. 4 So, being sent out by the Holy Spirit, they went down to Seleucia and from there they sailed to Cyprus.
Acts 20:28 "Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.
He has a will
1 Corinthians 12:11 But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually (kaqw.j bou,letai) just as He wills.
He has an opinion about things
NAS Acts 15:28 "For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay upon you no greater burden than these essentials:
He can be insulted
NKJ Hebrews 10:29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?
The word for Holy Spirit is neuter in gender. Doesn't this prove he's not a person?
Its a moot point.
The Father is referred to at times by the neuter gender! Does this make him a personal force?
Father referred to in neuter gender
John 4:22 "You worship that which you do not know; we worship (o] oi;damen) that which we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
Jesus referred to himself as mei/zo,n (neuter for me,gaj)
Matthew 12:6 "But I say to you, that something greater than the temple is here.
le,gw de. u`mi/n o[ti tou/ i`erou/ mei/zo,n evstin w-deÅ
i.e., he was a greater thing than the temple
Jesus was a greater thing than Jonah
Matthew 12:41 "The men of Nineveh shall stand up with this generation at the judgment, and shall condemn it because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and (ivdou. plei/on [neuter of polu,j] VIwna/ w-de) behold, something greater than Jonah is here. 42 "The Queen of the South shall rise up with this generation at the judgment and shall condemn it, because she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and behold, something greater than Solomon is here.
Does the fact that Jesus referred to himself in neuter gender make him an impersonal force?
Back to the Holy Spirit Sometimes referred to with masculine nouns
He's also called o` para,klhtoj which is a masculine noun.
Thus, the same logic the J.W.s use to prove He is not a person can be used to show that he is a person.
John 15:26 "When the Helper (o` para,klhtoj) comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, (evkei/noj marturh,sei peri. evmou/) He will bear witness of Me
Not Just a New Testament Doctrine
If Trinity is true we would expect to see a multi-personal God in the Old Testament.
That is, we'd expect to see the 3 persons of the Godhead interacting, distinct from each other.
This is exactly what we see.
Genesis God addresses Himself in the plural.
Genesis 1:26 Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth." 27 God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
How do anti-Trinitarians answer this passage?
They say its a plural of majesty much like queen Victoria of England who said, We are not easily amused.
However, there was no plural of majesty in the Hebrew language during biblical times.
They're taking a 19th century practice and reading it into an ancient text.
NAU Genesis 3:22 Then the LORD God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil
Tower of Babel Let Us go down
NAU Genesis 11:7 "Come, let Us go down and there confuse their language, so that they will not understand one another's speech." 8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from there over the face of the whole earth; and they stopped building the city. 9 Therefore its name was called Babel, because there the LORD confused the language of the whole earth; and from there the LORD scattered them abroad over the face of the whole earth.
Verbs come and confuse both in plural
Call of Isaiah Who will go for Us?
NAU Isaiah 6:8 Then I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, "Whom shall I send, and who will go for Us?" Then I said, "Here am I. Send me!"
God will deliver them by YHVH their God
Hosea 1:7 "But I will have compassion on the house of Judah and deliver them by the LORD their God, and will not deliver them by bow, sword, battle, horses, or horsemen."
The YHVH their God is clearly a different Person from the YHVH who is speaking.
If I as the first person promise to do something for you as the second person through a third person, am I not implying that I am not the same as the third person? If grammar means anything, the answer is,
The Lord GOD has sent Me, and His Spirit/
Isaiah 48:12 "Listen to Me, O Jacob, even Israel whom I called; I am He, I am the first, I am also the last. 13 "Surely My hand founded the earth, And My right hand spread out the heavens; When I call to them, they stand together. 14 "Assemble, all of you, and listen! Who among them has declared these things? The LORD loves him; he shall carry out His good pleasure on Babylon, And His arm shall be against the Chaldeans. 15 "I, even I, have spoken; indeed I have called him, I have brought him, and He will make his ways successful. 16 "Come near to Me, listen to this: From the first I have not spoken in secret, From the time it took place, I was there. And now the Lord God has sent Me, and His Spirit."
Here we see all 3 Persons of the Godhead interacting with each other.
How can non-Trinitarians handle a passage like this? They can't!
The Theophanies:
A Testament To The Multi-Personal Nature of God
The word comes from two Greek words
qeo,j + fai,nei = lit. manifestation, appearance of God (in human form)
Best proof in the Old Testament that God is multi-personal. In it, we see the Messenger of YHVH, who is distinct from YHVH, being called YHVH Himself.
Genesis 3:8 God comes to Adam and Eve in the form of a man
NAS Genesis 3:8 And they heard the sound of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and the man and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of the garden.
How could Adam and Even hide from an all-present, invisible spirit?
Passage only makes sense if God appeared in physical body.
They could hear God walking in a specific direction. They physically ran away from him and hid down.
Numbers 12:6-8 Moses beheld the form of God:
NAS Numbers 12:6 He said, "Hear now My words: If there is a prophet among you, I, the LORD, shall make Myself known to him in a vision. I shall speak with him in a dream. 7 "Not so, with My servant Moses, He is faithful in all My household; 8 With him I speak mouth to mouth, Even openly, and not in dark sayings, And he beholds the form of the LORD. Why then were you not afraid To speak against My servant, against Moses?"
Mouth to mouth he had a mouth by which he could speak
· Mouth requires a face
· Face requires a head
· Head requires a body
· The form in which God spoke to Moses was in a physical body!
Genesis 19:24 - 2 YHVHs?
Genesis 19:24 Then the LORD rained on Sodom and Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven,
A contrast between heaven and earth. Fire comes down from the heavens to the earth below.
Get background Genesis 18:1-33
(read from Bible)
If the Trinity is true we would expect to find passages like this.
Jacob wrestles with YHVH God:
NAS Genesis 32:24 Then Jacob was left alone, and a man wrestled with him until daybreak. 25 And when he saw that he had not prevailed against him, he touched the socket of his thigh; so the socket of Jacob's thigh was dislocated while he wrestled with him. 26 Then he said, "Let me go, for the dawn is breaking." But he said, "I will not let you go unless you bless me." 27 So he said to him, "What is your name?" And he said, "Jacob." 28 And he said, "Your name shall no longer be Jacob, but Israel; for you have striven with God and with men and have prevailed." 29 Then Jacob asked him and said, "Please tell me your name." But he said, "Why is it that you ask my name?" And he blessed him there. 30 So Jacob named the place face of God Penuel), for he said, "I have seen God face to face, yet my life has been preserved."
Hosea 12:4-6 says Jacob wrestled with God:
NAS Hosea 12:4 Yes, he wrestled with the angel and prevailed; He wept and sought His (the angels) favor. He found Him (the angel) at Bethel, And there He (the angel) spoke with us, 5 Even the LORD, the God of hosts; The LORD is His name. 6 Therefore, return to your God, Observe kindness and justice, And wait for your God continually.
Exodus 24 The Elders Saw God
NAS Exodus 24:9 Then Moses went up with Aaron, Nadab and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel, 10 and they saw the God of Israel; and under His feet there appeared to be a pavement of sapphire, as clear as the sky itself. 11 Yet He did not stretch out His hand against the nobles of the sons of Israel; and they beheld God, and they ate and drank. 12 Now the LORD said to Moses, "Come up to Me on the mountain and remain there, and I will give you the stone tablets with the law and the commandment which I have written for their instruction."
Septuagint is more descriptive:
Exodus 24:10 kai. ei=don to.n to,pon ou- ei`sth,kei evkei/ o` qeo.j tou/ Israhl kai. ta. u`po. tou.j po,daj auvtou/
And they saw the place where the God of Israel stood, and under His feet
Ezekiel Sees the form of a Man
NAS Ezekiel 1:25 And there came a voice from above the expanse that was over their heads; whenever they stood still, they dropped their wings. 26 Now above the expanse that was over their heads there was something resembling a throne, like lapis lazuli in appearance; and on that which resembled a throne, high up, was a figure with the appearance of a man. 27 Then I noticed from the appearance of His loins and upward something like glowing metal that looked like fire all around within it, and from the appearance of His loins and downward I saw something like fire; and there was a radiance around Him. 28 As the appearance of the rainbow in the clouds on a rainy day, so was the appearance of the surrounding radiance. Such was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the LORD. And when I saw it, I fell on my face and heard a voice speaking
2:4 "And I am sending you to them who are stubborn and obstinate children; and you shall say to them, 'Thus says the LORD GOD.'
(Q.) What do we do with Exodus 22:18-33? No Man Can See Me And Live
Exodus 33:18 Then Moses said, "I pray Thee, show me Thy glory!" 19 And He said, "I Myself will make all My goodness pass before you, and will proclaim the name of the LORD before you; and I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will show compassion on whom I will show compassion." 20 But He said, "You cannot see My face (to Jew, glory), for no man can see Me and live!" 21 Then the LORD said, "Behold, there is a place by Me, and you shall stand there on the rock; 22 and it will come about, while My glory is passing by, that I will put you in the cleft of the rock and cover you with My hand until I have passed by. 23 "Then I will take My hand away and you shall see My back, but My face shall not be seen."
Moses was not asking to see another visible form of YHVH. He'd already seen that:
Numbers 12:8 With him I speak mouth to mouth, Even openly, and not in dark sayings, And he beholds the form of the LORD.
He didn't want to see the form, but the essence of God.
Because were told if a person were to behold the full quintessential Being of God, they would instantly die.
A Special Theophany:
The Angel of the LORD (YHVH)
Who is He?
In your Bible as Angel with capital A.
This Man was actually a manifestation of God in human form in the role of a messenger.
Mistakes we make when we hear the word angel:
· we picture babies with wings
· picture our long lost grandfather with a halo sitting on a cloud, playing a harp
Most of this thinking comes from Western art, not the Bible!
When we say that the Angel of the LORD was God himself, we're not saying that God put on wings and a halo!
It simply means that YHVH God appeared to deliver a message to people.
The Hebrew word for angel(malak %a'l.m simply means messenger
Genesis 32:3 Then Jacob sent messengers before him to his brother Esau in the land of Seir, the country of Edom.
Genesis 16:7-14 Hagar sees Messenger of YHVH
NAS Genesis 16:7 Now the angel of the LORD found her by a spring of water in the wilderness, by the spring on the way to Shur. 8 And he said, "Hagar, Sarai's maid, where have you come from and where are you going?" And she said, "I am fleeing from the presence of my mistress Sarai." 9 Then the angel of the LORD said to her, "Return to your mistress, and submit yourself to her authority." 10 Moreover, the angel of the LORD said to her, "I will greatly multiply your descendants so that they shall be too many to count." 11 The angel of the LORD said to her further, "Behold, you are with child, And you shall bear a son; And you shall call his name Ishmael, Because the LORD has given heed to your affliction. 12 "And he will be a wild donkey of a man, His hand will be against everyone, And everyone's hand will be against him; And he will live to the east of all his brothers." 13 Then she called the name of the LORD who spoke to her, "Thou art a God who sees"; for she said, "Have I even remained alive here after seeing Him?" 14 Therefore the well was called Beer-lahai-roi; behold, it is between Kadesh and Bered.
Believing that a man must die if he saw God, she was astonished that she had seen God and lived.
Exodus 20:19 Then they said to Moses, "Speak to us yourself and we will listen; but let not God speak to us, lest we die."
Exodus 33:20 But He said, "You cannot see My face, for no man can see Me and live!"
Genesis 22:9-14 Abraham sees Divine Messenger
Genesis 22:9 Then they came to the place of which God had told him; and Abraham built the altar there, and arranged the wood, and bound his son Isaac, and laid him on the altar on top of the wood. 10 And Abraham stretched out his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. 11 But the angel of the LORD called to him from heaven, and said, "Abraham, Abraham!" And he said, "Here I am." 12 And he said, "Do not stretch out your hand against the lad, and do nothing to him; for now I know that you fear God, since you have not withheld your son, your only son, from Me [i.e., the Messenger]." 13 Then Abraham raised his eyes and looked, and behold, behind him a ram caught in the thicket by his horns; and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the place of his son. 14 And Abraham called the name of that place The LORD Will Provide, as it is said to this day, "In the mount of the LORD it will be provided."
Nowhere in Scripture are sacrifices made to angels. This is blasphemy.
Exodus 3 Moses meets the Messenger of YHVH
NAS Exodus 3:1 Now Moses was pasturing the flock of Jethro his father-in-law, the priest of Midian; and he led the flock to the west side of the wilderness, and came to Horeb, the mountain of God. 2 And the angel of the LORD appeared to him in a blazing fire from the midst of a bush; and he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, yet the bush was not consumed. 3 So Moses said, "I must turn aside now, and see this marvelous sight, why the bush is not burned up." 4 When the LORD saw that he turned aside to look, God called to him from the midst of the bush, and said, "Moses, Moses!" And he said, "Here I am." 5 Then He said, "Do not come near here; remove your sandals from your feet, for the place on which you are standing is holy ground."
6 He said also, "I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob." Then Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look at God.
7 And the LORD said, "I have surely seen the affliction of My people who are in Egypt, and have given heed to their cry because of their taskmasters, for I am aware of their sufferings. 8 "So I have come down to deliver them from the power of the Egyptians 12 And He said, "Certainly I will be with you, and this shall be the sign to you that it is I who have sent you: when you have brought the people out of Egypt, you shall worship God at this mountain."
13 Then Moses said to God, "Behold, I am going to the sons of Israel, and I shall say to them, 'The God of your fathers has sent me to you.' Now they may say to me, 'What is His name?' What shall I say to them?" 14 And God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM"; and He said, "Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, 'I AM has sent me to you.'"
15 And God, furthermore, said to Moses, "Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, 'The LORD (YHVH), the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.' This is My name forever, and this is My memorial-name to all generations.
Exodus 23:20-21 Divine Messenger guides Israel
NAS Exodus 23:20 "Behold, I am going to send an angel before you to guard you along the way, and to bring you into the place which I have prepared. 21 "Be on your guard before him and obey his voice; do not be rebellious toward him, for he will not pardon your transgression, since My name (YHVH) is in him.
Only God can forgive sins.
My name is in him
Jew would understand that the Messenger has the same nature as God from this statement. To a Jew, God and his name are convertible terms.
Judges 2:1-5 Messenger of YHVH rebukes nation of Israel
Judges 2:1 Now the angel of the LORD came up from Gilgal to Bochim. And he said, "I brought you up out of Egypt and led you into the land which I have sworn to your fathers; and I said, 'I will never break My covenant with you, 2 and as for you, you shall make no covenant with the inhabitants of this land; you shall tear down their altars.' But you have not obeyed Me; what is this you have done? 3 "Therefore I also said, 'I will not drive them out before you; but they shall become as thorns in your sides, and their gods shall be a snare to you.'" 4 And it came about when the angel of the LORD spoke these words to all the sons of Israel, that the people lifted up their voices and wept. 5 So they named that place Bochim; and there they sacrificed to the LORD.
Judges 6:11-22 Gideon sees Messenger of YHVH and lives!
Judges 6:11 Then the angel of the LORD came and sat under the oak that was in Ophrah, which belonged to Joash the Abiezrite as his son Gideon was beating out wheat in the wine press in order to save it from the Midianites. 12 And the angel of the LORD appeared to him and said to him, "The LORD is with you, O valiant warrior." 13 Then Gideon said to him, "O my lord, if the LORD is with us, why then has all this happened to us? And where are all His miracles which our fathers told us about, saying, 'Did not the LORD bring us up from Egypt?' But now the LORD has abandoned us and given us into the hand of Midian." 14 And the LORD (YHVH) looked at him and said, "Go in this your strength and deliver Israel from the hand of Midian. Have I not sent you?" 15 And he said to Him (the Messenger), "O Lord, how shall I deliver Israel? Behold, my family is the least in Manasseh, and I am the youngest in my father's house." 16 But the LORD (YHVH) said to him, "Surely I will be with you, and you shall defeat Midian as one man."
17 So Gideon said to Him, "If now I have found favor in Thy sight, then show me a sign that it is Thou who speakest with me. 18 "Please do not depart from here, until I come back to Thee, and bring out my offering and lay it before Thee." And He said, "I will remain until you return."
19 Then Gideon went in and prepared a kid and unleavened bread from an ephah of flour; he put the meat in a basket and the broth in a pot, and brought them out to him under the oak, and presented them. 20 And the angel of God said to him, "Take the meat and the unleavened bread and lay them on this rock, and pour out the broth." And he did so. 21 Then the angel of the LORD put out the end of the staff that was in his hand and touched the meat and the unleavened bread; and fire sprang up from the rock and consumed the meat and the unleavened bread. Then the angel of the LORD vanished from his sight. 22 When Gideon saw that he was the angel of the LORD, he said, "Alas, O Lord God! For now I have seen the angel of the LORD face to face."
Last verse shows that there are several persons who are YHVH at the same time. I probably edited this reply a hundred times, but I do what I can.
Ephesians 3:4 - Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ