Christian/Muslim ThreadsLucifers Pride!Perhaps you take me for a little kid with no knowlege of what I am debating about, if that is the case you are wrong very wron. I am the manager of: http://groups.msn.com/IslamChristianty, and I was invited to this site by, I suppose a muslim to debate with Christians. And since I was free, meaning not debating with anyone else I took the oppurtunity to learn and from others and hopefully someone will be educated by my knowlege. The Christian have been translating the names through out the origins of the Christian faith. They have transtlated names of people places and even the name of the god in the places where it suites there interest. For example, the name of the apostale Peter in hebrew meant (i dont remeber what his name was) "the rock" so the translator of the Hebrew bible translated his name to "Petros" and from that we have the English derivitive "Peter". And this practice very common in the Christian scholarly fields even to this day. Now the Christians want to prove that Jesus said that I am god, so they went ahead and translated the word "Ehejeh asher Ehejeh" to mean "I am, I am" so they can tell the Christian congregation that look Jesus said "I am", so he must be god cause "Ehejeh asher Ehejeh" means "I am, I am", and thats what the name of god is. The truth is quite contrary to that the prhase "Ehejeh asher Ehejeh" means "I will be what I will be", please see this link to verify, for your self: http://bible.crosswalk.com/Commentaries ... ryComplete
And its the fact that Jesus never said "I will be what I will be" and if he did, its not an evidence which proves that he is god, cause if he was God then he would have openly said that I am god, and he never said worship me. And we cases where the magi worship Jesus; its a deliberate distortation of the Greek translation, anyone with little knowlege of old Clasical Greek knows that, it doesnt mean that they worshiped him instead they praised him, something like this "Oh look at cute baby Jesus, doenst he look cute!" or "Oh look at his eyes, they are so beatifull, goochee, goochee gooo"Or if lets suppose "Ehejeh asher Ehejeh" does mean "I am, that I am", how many times in the day you use this phras "I am" in a day? Many time, you will aggree but does that mean you are calling your self god! Ofcourse not you are just using this language, thats how we all talk. And Jesus was no different then us, he spoke just like we do. I mean I had written this to you:
Now look I am god too, cause I said I am, and the Ex 3:14 says that I am is the name of the god, hurry up christians bow to me, it time to pray. :roll: This is something new, but not out of my reach, so here goes another round of punching the christian stars. One of the most common trait found among the Christians is "Quoting out of Context", from big Tom to little Dick, too stupid Harry, they all can quote the bible, but all out of context. Only time they bather to read the context is that when they have been cornered, (like the JW's were once at my house) they want you to read the context, otherwise they quote, and quote, and never stop, and they even can go on to prove that Pakistan was prophsied in the Bible (obviously if they quote out of context). What was the context in which Jesus said this phrase? Some will start readind this instance from beginning (John 8:1-59) to dray the relevent context, but I will draw the context from a different source, thats the history. Jesus was a prophet sent to the Jews, who waited for the arrival of their long waited Messiah who will come and liberate them from the trynical Roman rule, and will re build the temple of Solomon, and so on. Jesus came to the Jews at a time when the Jews where devided among them selves into many sects. Pharisees, Sedducees, Zealots, they all had there own version of Messiah, and they all beleive that there was the true one. When Jesus began preaching the Jews came and asked him "Master if thou be the christ plainly" they are allegeing that he is not clarifying who he is. They again and again send delegations to find out who he really is. So Jesus says "I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.". And there denial of a messenger of God will be denial of God himself, so if they deny Jesus then they are going to die in sin, for not beleiving in a messenger of God who was supposed to be fallowed, and if they didnt they will be punished according to the severity for their denial of Gods Messenger. To convince the Jesus said "I am he" (he didnt say "I am He"), telling the Jews I am the Messiah. Now the Christians will says well Jesus didnt say I am Messiah, he only said I am he. I will explain this, something like the story of David and Goaliath: "The phalistines bring a gaint to fight Jews, and in return Jews take their Army to fight the Phalistine Army, all the Jews are scared of this gaint Goliath, David says that he will kill this giant, he takes his sling shot, little David puts a stone in his sling shot and hurles a stone at Goliath and the stones hits Goliath, Goliath is dead, and little David is a hero of the nation" Now suppose two Jewish soilders are talking in a pub after the battle with phalistines, with some civilians who didnt get to see the war and didnt know the result of War and didnt know how the Jewish Army won the fight.. Now suppose you was sitting in the same pub with these two Jewish soilders, what will you understand, you dont know what David did, nor how he did it, or how big Goliath was? You wouldn't know anything about the detail of the battle, but soon has you are told about how David killed the Goliath, you will understand what the soilders where talking about and why JewTwo said that I couldnt do it in a million year. In the same why all the Jews where fully aware of Jesus and his claim, he didnt need to repeat the samething again and again, cause they all knew that he is the Messiah but they were not convinved about his title. So to assure them that he said look "I am he" the same messiah you are waiting for. It only proves that Jesus made the claim for the Messiahship not for God. He again and agian said in the bible that he is sent by the FAther and he also said that the one who is sent is not greater then the one who sent him the only position Jesus has is the Messenger of God, like rest of the Messengers, David, Moses, Abraham, and Solomon. Jesus said "Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life." So his refference to "I am he" could have been a refferenc to this statement, if we look at the biblical context. He had said beleive that "I am he" the light of this world and those who fallow me shall never see darkness. Now a Christian will say look Muhammed Can't b a messenger cause jesus has said that he is the light of the earth, but Jesus said "As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world. Joh (9:5)" So according to Jesus has long has he is in the world there can not be anyone else has the light of the world but when he leaves the world then someone else can be the light of the world. Verily verily I Ali say unto you before Ibrahim, Moses, David, Solomon, Jesus, and Muhammed (peace be on all of the Propehts) were born on earth I was. And if I lie then the curse of Allah be on me. What Jesus means is that he was in the spiritual form in the heaven before Abrahim was born in the form of human on the earth. He is saying that I was before Ibrahim in heaven but Ibrahim while the Jews think Jesus is claiming to be older then Abrahim. They failed to understand what Jesus was actuallly saying that he was still in existance in heaven long before Ibrahim came to the world, infact we all where in heaven at the same time with Jesus we only came to the world at a different time. Cause when God Created the entire Univverse he created everything that will go in the earth, God created our souls in heaven he only clothes them in body when he decrees the souls to go in the world thats what Jesus was saying "Before Abrahim was in the form of Human being on earth, I existed before that in heaven." "Jesus is clearly saying that he is divine and from God if you compare the Old Testament sayings with the New Testament sayings. Again this is only 0.3% proof that the bible has supporting that Jesus was God in the flesh." I say to you, Jesus was indeed devine but he was not God, he was only a messenger of God just like Moses, Muhammed are. No where Jesus said I am god worship me, its you, who is attributig this filthy lie against a mighty prophet of Allah. I just want to show you a Christian practice: the words Jesus Christ are not in any of the Quranic translations I have read, it looks like the Christian wholly spirit is playing its tricks on me, but I am greater then that lieing spirit. Reffering to the message posted by "Webmaster". Have a nice day Was-salam Ali |
🌈Pride🌈 goeth before Destruction
When 🌈Pride🌈 cometh, then cometh Shame