Christian/Muslim ThreadsThe moon god - al-ilahYou didnt prove anything here. It was already explained from islamic doctrine that the pagan worshiped idols in association with Allah. "Tahannuth" Do you know what this word means ? It is to withdraw to seclusion in the cause of religous purification, which is indeed and act of worship. Muhammad did withdraw to the cave on Mount Hira in the mountain to worship Allah. This is not a pagan pratice exclusively, Christian monks or Monophisite Christians did the same and the Essenes. Now tell me If Allah is Hubal how could he go to Mount Hira in a cave for a month to worship Allah which is three miles north of Makka and that took 4 hours to climb when Hubal was in the Ka'abah in Makkah ? Just like the first one, your quote doesnt prove a thing. We already pointed out the fact from doctrine that the pagans worshiped the Idols as Intercessors with Allah. The Quotes on [ ] are interpolations, must be yours. All that assaulting has nothing to do with the topic. You are mixing your christian perspective here. Who cares what you think, what does the doctrine say ? This has nothing to do with what you believe and that is what you are introducing "..Mohammed was simply a pagan, he even incorporated the paganistic rites of walking around the ka'ba 7 times, and had the nerve to justify it by claiming this is the religion of Abraham, that Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, .." You just cant keep you own personal vandata out of this. You believed this before you even got a whole of Hadith. It is common that if you are not a Christian then you are automatically a PAGAN. According to who ? Where is this comming from ? Again this is your own conjecture, your wishful thinking. Where is the proof ? we dont wanna here YAP YAP YAP ! Show some proof of this . No you are not. You are using hadith and you own unbias perspective in the light of Christianity. you have a habit of throwing sucker punches. You go off an attack another part of islam that doesnt have nothing to do with the topic. I read your post. I disagree with you interpretation. Now you asking me to do something I dont want to do, but since you asked then sure: Please go back to your bible, get a concordance to get its Lexical # and then GO to a lexicon. Now why were christians translators trying to hide this by translating Baal in Hebrew as Husband ? Well to behonest. The Word Baal just doesnt only mean lord but its expresses to be married. I know what the hebrew says in my Tanakh. In the Hebrew the word Baal is not a common noun ending in tanween or that is to say a grammatical mark indicating the noun as being indefinite, it is a Proper noun refering to the pagan god BAAL. The Verse above is explaining a particular history of the Jews of what they did after they broke their covenant they associated Baal with Yhwh. It is undisputed that they worshiped Baal. Our dispute is if they associated Baal with Yhwh. Note: A concordance is NOT a lexicon. Well the Jews after following the way of the heathen, their religion was REFORMED, mostly by the Sanhedrin after they reuturned from Babylon in which Christianity centuries later emerged from. Again this is your perspective. Your taking what you want out of the religion to claim it as pagan derived. Remember you dont believe whatsoever about anything of the religion having any ties to Abraham. You are still on this issue when we have shown from doctrine about the history of the religion that is traced to Abraham from islamic doctrine. You want to use what you want out of the doctrine of islam but ignoring the other crucial evidence of Quranic versus that explain the descent of the religion. How did Isaac and Jacob get into this ? THe Quran only speaks of Abraham and Ishmael in connection with the Ka'abah this shows how much you dont know and you have never read the Quran before. By the way what evidence are you talking about ? I hope you are not talking about evidence out side islam teaching cause you would be reneging on what you said cause the only evidence we are going by is that which in islamic teachings. I guess the only evidence you are talking about is evidence out side Islam. YOu have a big problem sticking to what you said in the begining. Also when I made the Quotes from those other writers it was that they understood the hadith the way I understood it to confirm that I was not interpolating, and also they recognized the same versus in Quran the as making a distinction that Alla is nto and Idol. I didnt want to quote a muslim source cause then it could be said to be biased so I quoted enemies of islam. I quoted them on the bases that we agreed on one particular issue even though they were critics. Exactly what I was talking about. Being that you look at islam as false, also means that you are not going to follow our chain of authority in Doctrine. So you will pick and choose what you want that you see fit you can use against us. Part of the islamic teaching is that the Quran supersedes hadith that you keep quoting. Also if the Hadith contradicts Quran or a particular INTERPRETATION that conflicts with QUran then it is also rejected as being a part of islamic Orthodaxical Teaching. Just like the Apocrypha Gospels. IF they contradict the Cannon versions they are rejected and not considered a part of the teaching of Chrisitianity. The Quran is the supreme authority, not the Hadith. You will have to come from Quran to prove you allegation cause it is the supreme authority in islam this is part of the islamic teaching. By you rejecting this then you are not following your own words : "..what does the quran and sunnah.." You showed nothing from Quran. You only Quoted hadith. Hadith in islam are not divine and they are not the words of Allah. Only the Quran is the word of Allah : If the Quran authenticates something as false then it is rejected which is not recognised as a teaching of islam. This is islamic teaching you did not follow. You made up your own rules of authority and interpretation. You amaze me. Ok lets see what else the Quran says Allah being LORD of : So lets see here according to your form of thinking then Allah then must be Jesus, Yhwh, and whatever else mankind worships? Ma'aadzallah ! The statement is a statement of demand, and reality of whom mankind's Lord is even if they accept it or not.
LOL ! When you get a correct translation let me know ok. By the way the challenge was EMBRYOLOGY. Man being made out of clay was not the issue of debate. I mentioned embryology and you went off into the clay issue...lol You keep on going off the topic. Attack the topic it self not those things out side it. Below is the correct translation of that verse. Have this reveiwed by you Christian Arab brothers at www.arabicbible.com Sorry to say the word "alaqah" original means " a thing that clings" which is derived from the root word "aliqa" ~ to hang , dangle, cling . The meaning "a clot of congealed blood" are modern medical terminologies of the arabic word. The root of alaqah does not SUPORT the meaning of "a clot of congealed blood" Have you ever studied Embryology ? How can you make a statement of "This is not a miracle, it is the utterings of a superstitious mind using already existent material" ? If you are a male more than likely you would know nothing about Embryology which is typical in this country. Sperm is translated from the word "NUTFAH". However again the word sperm also is a modern medical terminolgy and is NOT the original meaning of the word. The word "NUTFAH" is a feminine verbal noun which is derived from the arabic word "natafa" meaning to trickle, or dribble, whereas the orignial meaning is "a thing that trickles". This "alaqah" or thing that trickles is defined by another name in the Quran: The thing that Trickles ie NUTFAH is defines as AMSHAAJ meaning "a gemete or germ". So tell me what is a sperm ? So we have confirmed what the NUTFAH is in the Quran. It is "a germ cell that trickles" http://www.kumc.edu/instruction/medicin ... e/male.htm The Quran says this thing the NUTFAH is placed into something that sojourns and implants or "Qararin Makeen" THe arabic words "Qarar" is a masculine noun that means a sojourner or one that temporarily stays or temoprarily resides often applied to a traveler. The second name it is called is "Makeen" an implanter or one that implants or something that implants itself which is also a masculine noun. What is this "Qararin Makeen" the strickling germ cell is placed in ? The female Ovum. When the female Ovum is released from the Ovary it TEMPORILY RESIDES in the Fallopian Tube until fertilization by a SINGLE Germ Cell called a Sperm that trickles to its destined location or if not fertilized within a due time the Ovum will erupt resulting into a female's menstral cycle. After fertilization the Ovum proceeds to the Utterus wher it Implants its self. This is called the egg implantation. Note: At this stage the cells cannot be seen with the human eye. After the implantation of the fertilized ovum it starts to cling to the walls of the Utterus of its mother in which the Umblimical Cord is developed from This goes far as the clothing of bones with muscle. This is identified as the 12th stage of development in which you CANNOT IDINTIFY WITH THE NAKED EYE, cause the embro as this stage is at 3-5 mm! Go and ask any Embrologist. I worked in the medical field and in order for us to look at the embro at this stage is through a microscope. You making the statement of "With Mohammed's alledge 9 wives and umpteen concubines he would have seen lots of miscarriages, the only time a foetus looks like congealed blood!." showed the visitors of this Forum your wantonness. Obviously you are unaware of the stages of embryology and I provided a link for your convienience in which the Quran is Identifying at its stage. Also please click on the picture for a closer look and see what looks like teeth marks that is the spinal development and also the Embryo its self looks like something chewed . These pics are microscopical images not poloride pics. http://anatomy.med.unsw.edu.au/cbl/embr ... Stages.htm Present this to an Embryolgist and have him send me his report that this is inaccurate with his PHD signiture and Medical facility and I will renounce Islam. However though, I would go back to Judaism, not Christianity, and reject Jesus as an imposter and a lier as being a former Jew beleived just like the charged you brong against Muhammad. Also, If you doubt the translation that I posted then go to www.arabicbible.com email them (your arabic speaking Christian brothers) the translation with your choice of translation and ask them which one is more accurate. Have a Nice Day ! |
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